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Use of Masks.

86K views 1K replies 51 participants last post by  james4beach 
#1 ·
This is a very interesting interview with George Gao, director-general of the Chinese Center for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) (PhD from Oxford!)

Not wearing masks to protect against coronavirus is a ‘big mistake,’ top Chinese scientist says

Not just about masks, but about how the Chinese handled the epidemic.

Anyone know where to buy masks - even non surgical ones? Like the ones we see many Asians wearing?

I do have three N95 masks. One is from 3M. The other two are made in China and called GOLD. The masks are actually designated N95v (I suspect the V may designate the valve that they have) The GOLD package of two cost me $2.99! These are intended for use when painting or doing other work that produces fine particles or droplets. We may use these when we go out, but just wondering if others have found sources of masks, other than home made.

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#3 ·
That is a dated video and that guy is not really qualified to advise us. Do we see medical people using those large respirators? I have one and they are very cumbersome. I have used it when doing some serious sanding of toxic paint. But for use while shopping or otherwise in public? No way.

It seems that authorities are now moving toward having everyone wear masks. But so far no guidance as to which type and where we might be able to get them.

This article provides some data on effectiveness of different types.
Face masks for COVID-19: A deep dive into the data
(Not very well written and hard to decide which types might be available and work for us now).

So what do we do? For now, I guess my wife and I will use the N95s we have and try to re-use using methods provided here in another thread.
 
#4 ·
Do we see medical people using those large respirators? I have one and they are very cumbersome.

It seems that authorities are now moving toward having everyone wear masks. But so far no guidance as to which type and where we might be able to get them.
I searched respirators on amazon just to see what's available and in the US those large 3M masks have this message

"Prioritized for hospitals and government agencies directly responding to COVID-19 in the U.S."

US military and government are now confiscating stockpiles and transports of N95 masks for frontline workers

If anything I'll just wear a buff style gaitor. I own lots of them and they're very comfortable. They also show up on amazon when you search for respirator

Probably doesn't filter as good as N95 but also does seal better to the face than the surgical style masks.
 
#6 ·
An Ontario company has already developed a similar mask to 3M's N96 mask. It is being tested for government approval.

Premier Ford set aside $50 million to help companies retool to manufacture medical equipment. It looks like a wise move on his part.

If approval is granted, the company should start producing masks in bulk in a few days. Ford says they will be capable of supplying all of Canada.

Hopefully we will soon see the masks on the shelves.
 
#11 ·
We had ordered some reusable masks off amazon earlier last month. They still haven’t arrived. They are still made in China and are not N95 but are better than nothing. Originally I bought them in case one of the people on my family get sick to protect the rest or at least all of us aren’t sick at the same time.

While waiting for them to arrive, I have followed the diy no sew options on line using a bandana, and elastics. Also, I found one using blue shop towels which I found several studies that are saying a double layer is up to 95% effective and bonus you can actually breath. I am in the process of making a few and then disinfecting them in my oven as they are good for up to 8 wears.

There are also a few local people who are sewing these masks and sellIng them. These options aren’t perfect but I will be playing around with combinations Soon.
 
#14 ·
The CDC does recommend using even home-made masks in public. They have some instructions here: Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)

CDC recommends wearing cloth face coverings in public settings where other social distancing measures are difficult to maintain (e.g., grocery stores and pharmacies), especially in areas of significant community-based transmission.
Any mask is likely better than none. I've been wearing dust masks when I go into stores because that's all I had. I plan to add an additional layer on the inside of my dust mask to strengthen the barrier a bit.

I'm also planning to start using a homemade fabric mask, either according to the CDC instructions or something else made from old t-shirts.
 
#15 ·
I'm also planning to start using a homemade fabric mask, either according to the CDC instructions or something else made from old t-shirts.
Scarf, keffiyeh/shemagh, balaclava, bandana, neck gaiter/buff. Should all do about the same as an old t-shirt

I tried them all for motorbiking and the knock off buffs are very comfortable and like 5 for $20. You can machine wash em and less fiddling around to put them on/off

Or one of the following









 
#17 ·
M3S. Thanks for the chuckle. I feel whatever I come up with will be better than the ones you posts. I did quite like the snorkel. There is a guy in my city that has been wearing his inflatable tricetops Halloween costume on walks. It’s been in the news and quite entertainment. The other day a few more people joined in the walk to make a little parade down the sidewalk. I would guess they were and good 5 meters apart when you accounted for the costumes.
 
#24 ·
There are problems with the general public all wearing masks.

First, most home made masks will offer little if any real protection. Second, suggesting it be done assumes there are enough effective masks available to provide them to everyone. Third, they can give people a false sense of security and can also allow people to self-justify not staying home as much as POSSIBLE.

There is no point in saying, 'wear a mask' if we do not FIRST have enough for all front line workers. Hospital, first responders etc. first and then those at higher risk through multiple interactions, like the people working in the supermarkets. There are a whole lot of people who should be being provided with masks before the general public should be. In FACT, there are simply not enough masks available for it to be practical to say to the general public, 'everyone should wear a mask.'

Just wearing a mask even an N95 mask does not make you safe. First you have to know how to actually fit one properly. Then you have to still not touch your face. You've probably seen the videos of people wearing masks but constantly adjusting them, pulling them up and down etc. They might as well not be wearing one and in some cases it is only resulting in them touching their faces more than they would be when not wearing one.

People just go on trying to find ways to go out in my opinion. The most effective way for anyone to fight this virus is to stay home. Next is physical distancing if you MUST go out. Then comes not touching your face and repeatedly washing your hands. Masks are well down the list of the most effective ways for the GENERAL PUBLIC to fight the virus.
 
#29 ·
The Communist World Government already has total control, achieved by the contrails spreading electronic dust. They spread the virus to cull the numbers of the Chinese, Europeans, and Americans. They keep their population safe by letting loose 500 lions on the streets of Moscow.
 
#27 ·
I’m still surprised that the world wasn’t a little better prepared. There have been enough movies to show what may occur.

for example.....would they not have “gamed“ out the scenario of limited mask supplies......it’s only now that Dr.Tam is advising hospital workers to keep their used masks while they figure out how to treat and re-use them.

I’m obviously no expert, but running out of supplies during a pandemic seems like a possible scenario that should have been thought of.......along with possible secondary measures to broaden supply.
 
#30 ·
I’m obviously no expert, but running out of supplies during a pandemic seems like a possible scenario that should have been thought of.......along with possible secondary measures to broaden supply.
Hah! We definitely thought of it but the majority ignore it like climate change

You should read up on all the other known issues we chose not to prepare for. I suspect after this the people will demand the government stock masks at great expense while refusing to instead do things that prepare in more intelligent ways. Go watch the Bill Gates TED talk from 2015

People will always cry why didn't the experts see this coming.. while ignoring the experts on anything else
 
#31 · (Edited)
Yeah people just ignore dangers. It reminds me of living in Oregon; I was pretty scared of earthquakes. I went to the trouble of getting enough emergency supplies (water, food, batteries/chargers, NOAA weather radio with emergency standby, etc). But any time I asked anyone, people truly did not care about the earthquake danger. Some people said "we all die when it's our time" and others said "I try not to think about it". Eventually, the west coast (BC, WA, OR) will get an absolutely massive earthquake so any rational person should want to prepare supplies. Very few do.

Interestingly, it was usually parents with young children who seemed best prepared for the earthquake danger. They were consistently the ones who had plans and preparation.

By the way, I remembered something else when moving out of Oregon. This one is really tragic (for me). Because I had foreseen the danger of a major disease outbreak (plus danger of rubble and dust from earthquake) my emergency kit actually had a pack of N95 masks, medical gloves, alcohol cleaning pads, etc.

When I was moving a few months ago, in perhaps my worst decision of recent years, I just gave my whole med kit including the N95 masks to a neighbour. I hope he's happy now. I worried they would get crushed if I shipped them with other heavy goods.
 
#32 ·
more people wear mask - slowdown spreading
also DIY mask could have around 60% own protection or Doubling the layers of material will increase more protection would be beneficial in current situation.

p.s.
I can't edit the post #26. Page 1 has shown 3 vertical dots but page 2 doesn't.
 
#33 ·
Here's an example of a US military document about pandemics that shows none of this was unforeseen

It warned a pandemic could impact the military for 24 months. It lists coronavirus having no known vaccine and the shortage of ventilators and medical PPE (ie masks)

Not realistic to be perfectly prepared for everything. I think at least having food and PPE production within your own country would cover many situations
 
#43 ·
I was debating about the alcohol spray. We have a commercial size jug of rubbing alcohol, but I was again worried about it breaking it down. I also have Clorox spray. Maybe a Clorox spray with a week between uses might work.

Recycling masks :
Time is one way to recycle masks. 4 or more days has been suggested.
Another that has been mentioned, is heat. Put in oven (not microwave) wet at about 70-75C for 30 minutes. Make sure mask is suspended and not in contact with metal that will be at much higher temperature than the air.

I think I read that recycling methods will soon be provided by health authorities here in Canada.

Supply of masks
What I don't understand, is that elsewhere in world, even 3rd world countries, the public seem to have a supply of masks. Few look home made. So how is it that they can get them, but we can't?
I have several types of mask that I ordered a while back or am making. I think waiting a week in between is a good idea. I will also try the oven, except some of them have a one way plastic filter valve which I feel would melt in the oven. For the non plastic masks, I think that would work. You mentioned not putting it on metal. Any ideas on that.?
 
#40 ·
Recycling masks :
Time is one way to recycle masks. 4 or more days has been suggested.
Another that has been mentioned, is heat. Put in oven (not microwave) wet at about 70-75C for 30 minutes. Make sure mask is suspended and not in contact with metal that will be at much higher temperature than the air.

I think I read that recycling methods will soon be provided by health authorities here in Canada.

Supply of masks
What I don't understand, is that elsewhere in world, even 3rd world countries, the public seem to have a supply of masks. Few look home made. So how is it that they can get them, but we can't?
 
#41 ·
Recycling masks :
Time is one way to recycle masks. 4 or more days has been suggested.
Another that has been mentioned, is heat. Put in oven (not microwave) wet at about 70-75C for 30 minutes. Make sure mask is suspended and not in contact with metal that will be at much higher temperature than the air.

I think I read that recycling methods will soon be provided by health authorities here in Canada.

Supply of masks
What I don't understand, is that elsewhere in world, even 3rd world countries, the public seem to have a supply of masks. Few look home made. So how is it that they can get them, but we can't?
Where it was standard practice to wear masks, there was means of producing and distributing them. Masks are cheap. They just were not popular in the West. We'll get there.
 
#45 ·
I think just 7 days on its own is more than enough to remove any risk from the virus. The virus can't replicate on its own without a host, and rapidly breaks down over time (exponential decay). The half life of the virus is shortest on porous surfaces (like a mask) and longest on surfaces like stainless steel. Regardless, after 7 days, regardless of surface, the number of virus particles that might remain is nearly 0. This is all at ambient temperatures. You can speed up the process with higher heat. Freezing slows the rate of decay.
 
#46 ·
Do you know all of that for sure? By that, I mean you have the medical background to make those statements as facts? Or are they just "facts" read off the internet? I do that too, but try and include the source.

We have to be careful about spreading unverified information.

Where it was standard practice to wear masks, there was means of producing and distributing them. Masks are cheap. They just were not popular in the West. We'll get there.
The pictures I referred to from 3rd world and other countries were from places where many had probably never seen a mask before Covid. Zimbabwe for example. In some countries in Africa, they are handing the masks out free to those that need to move about. In South America, places like Equador the government has ruled that everyone must be masked. (El Comercio) Did they have them readily available? I doubt it somehow but they now seem to.
 
#53 ·
I won't be wearing one unless I get symptomatic

“There is currently no evidence that wearing a mask, whether medical or other types, by healthy persons in the wider community setting, including universal community masking, can prevent them from infection with respiratory viruses, including Covid-19,” a report released late Monday by the World Health Organization said.
 
#55 ·
The change in recommendation is that wearing a mask prevents you from spreading your germs to others since they believe spread can occur before any symptoms surface. The amount of protection varies for the mask wearer depending on the type of mask and if they follow proper protocols.

I am even getting masks for my kids in case they need to get used to it if becomes a requirement in the fall when they return to school. I am having them practice now to get into a good habit before they must wear the masks.
 
#56 ·
My mother has been making cloth masks. I will pick some up from here this weekend (porch pickup) and start wearing them when I go in public. I think we all need to get into the habit of wearing masks in public whether we are symptomatic or not to help reduce the risk of spreading to others. If enough people do this we should be able to help reduce the spread.

I still think the wearing of gloves (and I see lots of them discarded on the ground as litter) as largely pointless. You still need to wash your hands when you return home. Just avoid touching your face between when you leave home and when you wash again after leaving home. Gloves don't protect you from touching your face. I think you're much better off wearing eye protection.
 
#57 ·
Breaking my 'no daytime social media' rule for a second, but I thought this was important.

Dr Brian Goldman on CBC Newsworld is recommending that everyone wear masks (cloth or whatever) when shopping in stores. I've already started.

Remember: don't touch the mask once you're in the store. If it falls or slips, leave it alone.

Like andrewf, I don't wear gloves. But I suspect that any mask helps. I have some old dust masks (basically provides a nice shell), and am adding cotton layers on the inside. I'm also going to use a bandanna with elastic bands as illustrated by the US CDC
Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)
 
#58 ·
I don't see how cutting a T-shirt or material like coffee filters and sewing in elastics is any different than simply using a neck tube that has elasticity built into the fabric

Neck tube costs about the same as a blank shirt (typically 5 for $20), more comfortable than those elastics on your ears imo, seals the sides to your face unlike the surgical masks and probably better than sewed elastics too, and just look less janky

Tuck a coffee filter or shop towel in if you want extra filtration. They say exposure is cumulative so even reducing exposure can help I imagine

SA neck gaiters (buff)
 
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