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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
You can't dispute the facts so you resort to name calling. Mature
I think it's fair to call you a far right troll, when you're spinning up lies to disparage Canadian government, while drawing false equivalency to a far right fascist / authoritarian. The things you post are straight out of the right wing propaganda playbook. @MrMatt has, for a long time, been using the same strategy you use. You guys both sound like trained far right propagandists.

In any case, Trump is a fascist monster, who tried to overthrow the United States of America. Quite possibly the worst abuse of power the US has seen in modern times.

Nothing similar happened in Canada, despite the fantasies of far right nuts. We obviously have fair elections, and nobody in Canadian government tried to suppress or overthrow the election process (duh).
 

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Your rhetoric is completely pointless and completely wrong. There have been authoritarian governments on both sides of the spectrum. It isn't exclusive to far-left or far-right.

Are you disputing the fact that Trudeau tried to strip parliament of its power and introduce authoritarianism in march of 2020? There was literally legislation he introduced to make himself a tyrant. It was on March 23, 2020. Luckily with just 32% of the vote he didn't have enough power to do that.

He didn't try to overthrow the election process. He just tried to ignore election results and strip power from democratically elected representatives.

He went Germany 1930s route, not Trump 2021.
Neither of them are good
 

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Figments of your imagination ?
 
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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Are you disputing the fact that Trudeau tried to strip parliament of its power and introduce authoritarianism in march of 2020? There was literally legislation he introduced to make himself a tyrant. It was on March 23, 2020.
Well now you're introducing political conspiracy theories. Please explain your allegation in detail, and point to reliable sources (reputable news coverage). How did Trudeau try to "introduce authoritarianism" in March? What legislation did he introduce to make himself a tyrant?
 

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He didn't try to overthrow the election process. He just tried to ignore election results and strip power from democratically elected representatives.
He didn't try to strip power.
He tried to get them to grant emergency powers for an extended period during a crisis. Yes it was a power grab, but it wasn't overthrowing parliment.
 

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I think it's fair to call you a far right troll, when you're spinning up lies to disparage Canadian government, while drawing false equivalency to a far right fascist / authoritarian. The things you post are straight out of the right wing propaganda playbook. @MrMatt has, for a long time, been using the same strategy you use. You guys both sound like trained far right propagandists.

In any case, Trump is a fascist monster, who tried to overthrow the United States of America. Quite possibly the worst abuse of power the US has seen in modern times.

Nothing similar happened in Canada, despite the fantasies of far right nuts. We obviously have fair elections, and nobody in Canadian government tried to suppress or overthrow the election process (duh).
Oh please, "trained far right propagandist".

Sheesh, point out the bad behaviour of "dear leader", and suddenly you're "far right".
I don't even hold any particularly "far right" views, I just strongly disapprove of racist authoritarians.
Now I'm not calling Trudeau fascist, because he isn't, he's an anti-nationalist. I don't think the believes in Canada.
“first postnational state”. “There is no core identity, no mainstream in Canada.”


That's the problem, you smear people you disagree with, and start name calling.
That's what's wrong with political discussion, you can't debate issues, you just retreat to name calling.
The problem I have is you only see danger from a single direction, the "far right' is your all encompassing boogieman. That's a problem.
You fail to see that there are dangers all around us, and you're completely blind to the dangers from your political allies. As Trudeau stokes racism, and implements racist policies, his supporters deny that treating people differently because of their skin colour is even racist.

I agree we have pretty fair elections. The US has a HUGE problem here. Their elections have far too much political interference. Trumps behaviour in particular was egregious.
But it's over, the electoral college ( the only vote that truly matters wrt to the presidency) has voted.

While the obvious dangers are a risk, the real danger is the things that aren't as obvious.
What I see as the real danger is that people are unwilling to discuss the dangers that aren't publicly recognized.
 

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As an American, I have faith in the branches of govt, in the institutions. More importantly the people that are there doing their jobs.

Trump IMHO instigated a protest at the capital. It was unruly but not surprisingly violent. While interesting, I never thought this protest would let him seize power with a mob and control America. It was in poor taste but was never gonna be more than news coverage....

The US branches of govt all operated as they were supposed to, thus, why they were designed as they were. No problem. Moreover I think the whole ’election turmoil’ more shows Trumps lack of understanding in how America operates, it was never gonna work.

It highlights the effectiveness of govt, it highlights the wisdom of our founding fathers.

Trump was/is power hungry, but his days are done, he’s a geriatric. Mind you so is Biden.

I really hope the next US election is more engaging....

As for Trudeau, he did try to grasp more power & was denied by govt. It operated properly. He is lame & IMHO needs to go. I think you’ll see him lose a confidence motion within the party and Mark Carney will be the new leader.... just my forecast..... shortly after this leadership swap, there will be yet another election.
 

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As for Trudeau, he did try to grasp more power & was denied by govt. It operated properly. He is lame & IMHO needs to go. I think you’ll see him lose a confidence motion within the party and Mark Carney will be the new leader.... just my forecast..... shortly after this leadership swap, there will be yet another election.
I don't think Mark Carney would want the job, he can do pretty much anything he wants, why would he stoop to being a politician?
Many politicians and senior staffers use their former office and connections as their post political career.
Carney already has this level of access, I can imagine many in positions of influence who wouldn't return his calls.

Star Candidates don't necessarily play well in Canadian politics anyway.

If he wanted to get political, he could simply consult for the governments he's interested in.
 

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Chrystia Freeland is the more likely choice to replace Trudeau.

The only question is when Trudeau decides to step down.
 

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Well now you're introducing political conspiracy theories. Please explain your allegation in detail, and point to reliable sources (reputable news coverage). How did Trudeau try to "introduce authoritarianism" in March? What legislation did he introduce to make himself a tyrant?
Introduced legislation that he can unilaterally, without input or vote from parliament, make any decisions that have to do with revenue or spending of the government (so pretty much any decision) until end of 2022.
That is very definition of authoritarianism
 

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He didn't try to strip power.
He tried to get them to grant emergency powers for an extended period during a crisis. Yes it was a power grab, but it wasn't overthrowing parliment.
I am sorry, but that is incredibly naive.
Enabling Act of 1933 was temporary as well
Powers given to Ceasar in Roman empire was supposed to be temporary as well.
Putin has term limits.

Setting up authoritarian state even if the authoritarian claims it is temporary is dangerous as hell
 

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It was unruly but not surprisingly violent. While interesting, I never thought this protest would let him seize power with a mob and control America. It was in poor taste but was never gonna be more than news coverage....

As for Trudeau,....He is lame & IMHO needs to go.
HP. Good points. Events on Jan 6th were not entirely surprising given all posturing by Trump et al in the months that preceded the election. It was going to get messy - I suspect that most Americans knew that - but they didn't know the lengths that Trump and others would go to cling to power. I agree that the institutions worked.
But,
when you listen to the article that James posted in the OP, the interviewer discusses the actions taken by Trump's "lawyers" to re-wire the Justice Dept. I don't know all the details, but, IMO that is the scary part. I can't recall the full transcript, but I do recall the interviewee mentioning "1/2 a step away from a catastrophe - a ripping up of the constitution" etc etc. It may all be theatre, but, that is scary.

As for Trudeau, there is no comparison with Trump. Trudeau tries to accommodate everyone and does not succeed, whereas Trump tries only to accommodate Republicans, and does not succeed. Trump doesn't really care what others think, whereas Trudeau does... I expect he'll take a walk in a snowstorm, and decide to leave some time in 2024.
 

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I am sorry, but that is incredibly naive.
Enabling Act of 1933 was temporary as well
Powers given to Ceasar in Roman empire was supposed to be temporary as well.
Putin has term limits.

Setting up authoritarian state even if the authoritarian claims it is temporary is dangerous as hell
Trudeaus power grab attempt(s) weren't as far reaching and were much more limited.


Honestly I think he's simply getting bored, and will likely move on anyway.
 

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hfp75
Trump taught us all that the checks and balances are largely an illusion, Being able to ignore demands for his personal finances, taking steps to make his family richer, making the AG his personal pawn, loading the Supreme Court and many more...

We have not seen the end of it!
 

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The main difference with Canada is that Trudeau is a lightweight by any measure. And his partner, the NDP loves spending other people's money more than him.
 

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hfp75
Trump taught us all that the checks and balances are largely an illusion, Being able to ignore demands for his personal finances, taking steps to make his family richer, making the AG his personal pawn, loading the Supreme Court and many more...

We have not seen the end of it!
Well since there is no legal requirement to disclose personal finances under US law, he SHOULD be able to ignore those demands.

The ethics problem of enriching your family is clearly a problem that needs to be dealt with, same with the AG. We have very little legal protection for the PM overstepping their authority here.

As well the Supreme court, the PM appoints them, the US needs the senate to confirm them.
Canada, it's just the PM.

Actually the Supreme court "loading", there was a vacancy, Trump filled it, Senate confirmed it, the system worked as it should.
I'd like to point out that Trudeau also filled vacancies on the Supreme court with his appointee.

If you're going to pick on things that they did bad, you should pick better examples. Half of the examples you listed are literally the job of the President, or silly demands that are not legally required.
 
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