Canadian Money Forum banner

1 - 20 of 279 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,479 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Given the current situation re coronavirus, our travel plans for this year are on indefinite hold. We had intended to do several trips this year, some short and some longer and farther. But as we do not follow the trend to book far ahead, none are already booked and so we can easily adopt a 'wait and see' attitude.

But a recent news report got my attention when it talked about people who have bookings in the next few months to various places in the world and on cruises. Unless the government puts out a Travel Advisory saying, 'avoid non-essential travel to X', someone with a pre-existing booking cannot cancel and expect to get their money back. Even those who have purchased separate Trip Cancellation insurance cannot expect that insurance policy to get them their money back.
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/can-you-cancel-a-flight-due-to-fear-of-coronavirus-1.4800922

In that link you will see the person saying, “If the Canadian government is allowing you to travel somewhere then believe me there is not going to be any issues,” he said. “If they have concerns they would create a travel warning which would trigger trip cancelation.” But that to me is a joke. The Canadian government or anyone else cannot guarantee you that you will be OK. Consider this example of a UK traveller and where and how he passed on the virus.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-coronavirus-French-health-minister-says.html

It could have as easily been some Canadian skiers in that situation. Is there a Travel Advisory against travel to France right now? Answer, no there is not. The fact is, there is no way to know where and how someone might contract the virus. The only way to avoid it is to never leave your home but while that is impractical, avoiding non-essential travel is not impractical.

So what does someone do who had booked travel and will lose money if they do not take the trip? Lose the money or take the risk? I'm just glad we never book more than a few weeks ahead of time and never book non-refundable air travel or hotels when we do travel.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
570 Posts
I would be avoiding all international airports right now until this virus issue gets resolved, losing money or not. When you see the lengths China is going to, trying to contain it and it's still spreading, makes me very concerned.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
3,308 Posts
I certainly wouldn't travel to China but many other locations, why not ... the odds appear low.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,028 Posts
I still plan to go to the Caribbean in a few weeks, but I am also paying for Sunwing's extra 'cancellation waiver' which allows even a last minute cancellation (for vouchers) just in case this thing start spreading more rapidly in North America
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,569 Posts
We are off to Mexico very shortly. Not concerned....until there are a bunch of cases in Mexico that is.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,028 Posts
Seems fine to me as well. There haven't been many cases in the Americas.

Does anyone here have experience with the Sunwing cancellation waiver? It sounds awfully flexible if I'm understanding it correctly, provided one is OK with receiving vouchers for future travel.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,702 Posts
... Even those who have purchased separate Trip Cancellation insurance cannot expect that insurance policy to get them their money back.
A lot depends on the separate insurance bought ... most will be like you say but I have had friends who bought the type that the decision is their choice. They changed their minds, cancelled and were paid.


... So what does someone do who had booked travel and will lose money if they do not take the trip? Lose the money or take the risk?
Friends are re-booking as canceling means losing everything where re-booking means a fee plus the fare difference.

For me it would depend on where and what the perceived risk was.


Cheers
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,569 Posts
Travel trip cancellation and interruption insurance is getting too expensive for us now that we have crossed 70 years of age.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,479 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
I certainly wouldn't travel to China but many other locations, why not ... the odds appear low.
Yes, they do. But just ask those who went skiing in the little French village of Contamines-Montjoie and caught the virus there. I mean, what were the chances that someone who caught the virus somewhere else, from someone else who had been to China, would be there at the same time, in the same chalets. A to B to C. Why the chances were 'slim and none' as they say but in their case, 'slim' won the toss of the coin.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,426 Posts
I still plan to go to the Caribbean in a few weeks, but I am also paying for Sunwing's extra 'cancellation waiver' which allows even a last minute cancellation (for vouchers) just in case this thing start spreading more rapidly in North America
Sunwing is Scummy AF.
Just look at them.

My personal experience is we landed in Cuba, and while taxiing to the arrivals gate they told us that they had lost their return flight and would update us on when our actual departure is, but didn't expect it to change by more than a few days earlier or later.
Further that our on resort agent would update us daily.

The "on resort" agent showed up twice that I saw, for less than 2 hours each time, until the morning of our departure when they posted a note on the office door.
It was completely unprofessional and poorly handled.

I wouldn't trust those guys at all.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
3,308 Posts
Yes, they do. But just ask those who went skiing in the little French village of Contamines-Montjoie and caught the virus there. I mean, what were the chances that someone who caught the virus somewhere else, from someone else who had been to China, would be there at the same time, in the same chalets. A to B to C. Why the chances were 'slim and none' as they say but in their case, 'slim' won the toss of the coin.
So, they "lost the coin toss" as you put it ... that doesn't effect me. Do proper risk assessment and decide for youself. I bet you're more likely to die driving to the airport than catching that virus on a vacation that isn't in China.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,479 Posts
Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
We are off to Mexico very shortly. Not concerned....until there are a bunch of cases in Mexico that is.
In the unfortunate event you do by whatever small chance, catch the virus in the airport, on the plane, or on the ground in Mexico, have you checked what facilities and preparations the local Mexican hospital has for your possible stay with them? It is as cainvest suggests, a small chance, it is not a question of 'no chance'. People do win lotteries, in this case it would be like 'losing' the lottery. Sooner or later, someone will be the SECOND confirmed case of coronavirus in Mexico, you're saying you are 'not concerned' about buying a lottery ticket to be the third person. There were 240 Mexican Uber users who had their accounts suspended because there was a possibility they rode in a vehicle in which a recent coronavirus infected person had rode. A to B just because you rode in a Uber or taxi. https://www.businessinsider.com/ube...s-mexico-to-stop-coronavirus-spreading-2020-2

The suspected person did in fact test positive but is not listed as a case in Mexico because he was from the USA and returned to the USA before being diagnosed. https://nypost.com/2020/02/04/coron...y-vacation-before-flying-back-to-los-angeles/

So don't think coronavirus has not been present in Mexico yet, it most definitely has. It appears they may have just got lucky in that it was not transmitted or detected in anyone still IN Mexico. There were 13,000 people who travelled from China to Mexico in January. No doubt others have this month on connecting flights. That's why the Mexican Health Ministry is saying the arrival of coronavirus in Mexico is 'imminent'.

So I'll say again, are you happy with what you can expect from the Mexican healthcare system if you 'win' the lottery?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,569 Posts
If I get quarantined at our 'all inclusive', I won't be terribly disappointed.

If I get it, well, I will call on my International extended health benefit insurance to take care of me. Point is that having ex-Canada health insurance is more important to me than sunk costs on plane tickets.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,332 Posts
We have another six weeks to go making our way up the Pacific coast of Mexico from Hualulco to Mazatlan. Just spent two weeks in Merida, Playa, and Puerto Morelos.

Sept/Oct is pretty well locked down to Morocco, Spain, and Portugal. Next winter hopefully back to Thailand.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,479 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
So, they "lost the coin toss" as you put it ... that doesn't effect me. Do proper risk assessment and decide for youself. I bet you're more likely to die driving to the airport than catching that virus on a vacation that isn't in China.
I'd rather try to avoid either possibility if I can. I can't avoid driving entirely but I can avoid taking a trip. Using logic of the type you have attempted cainvest, is simply not logical at all. That one thing is more likely than another is not a question of one ruling out the other as not something to be concerned about.

Just how do you do a 'proper risk assessment' cainvest? Are you qualified in assessing such a risk? I use a reputable organization to determine what the risk is to me. In this case, I trust no individual government body's assessment since they have too many influences both political and economic that tend to make them downplay the risk as much and for as long as they can. The only organization that I listen to in cases like this is the World Health Organization and their assessment of the risk as being the LEAST influenced by politics or economic fallout. But even they are not without criticism. Their current assessment of the Risk at present is HIGH globally and has been since the end of January.

They still have not designated it as Public Health Emergency. When they do that, that's when the crap really hits the fan. I don't think that I want to wait till they raise it to that risk level before I decide to curtail my travel plans. But to each his own, I suggest checking on what to expect in terms of healthcare if you do decide to travel somewhere. The last thing I would want is some less than great healthcare if I did contract the virus.
https://www.sciencealert.com/who-tries-to-correct-wuhan-coronavirus-risk-level
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,072 Posts
We have another six weeks to go making our way up the Pacific coast of Mexico to Mazatlan. .
You might already know but hit up Las Brochetas
Really good chicken molcajete and local big *** shrimp.
Bring your own wine...liquor store across the street. Use a pulmonías to get around...cheap.
I guess it shows I really miss that town.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
3,308 Posts
I'd rather try to avoid either possibility if I can. I can't avoid driving entirely but I can avoid taking a trip. Using logic of the type you have attempted cainvest, is simply not logical at all. That one thing is more likely than another is not a question of one ruling out the other as not something to be concerned about.
You obviously missed the point of the comparison, the risks of dying while driving are small, not many people give it a second thought when they get into their cars for the daily routine, I know I don't, I'm guessing maybe you do? To me, the risk of dying from the coronavirus are equally as small so I don't really give it a second thought but I would dig much deeper into it if I was going to China.

Just how do you do a 'proper risk assessment' cainvest? Are you qualified in assessing such a risk?
Of course I'm qualified to assess my own risks, being an adult, I do it all the time. :)
For something like this it's just a pure numbers game, very few are infected outside of China so the risk is minimal for nearby vacation travel. Also remember the mortality rate is 1% so even if you do get it there is a good chance you're be ok unless you're already sick or weak.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,582 Posts
We did a lot of international travel last year, so won't be much this year.
Trip to Vegas. Fly to Ontario. Maybe a weekend trip to California.

My inlaws have a south american cruise booked next month I think.
 
1 - 20 of 279 Posts
Top