Canadian Money Forum banner

2521 - 2540 of 2585 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,194 Posts
"Mass clinics"? We routinely vaccinate 30-40% for flu shots. I'd expect COVID19 to be similar.


This whole "mass vaccination" thing seems silly, we had the highest flu shot takeup in years, and we were done everyone within 2 months. We're able to inject the vaccine faster than we can get it. If we got enough COVID19 vaccine we'd be done.

I think the media isn't helping this.
I suppose. But 40% of the population 18+ getting one shot seems a little easier than the hoped-for 70-80% of the covid shot for 12+. I would think we would need double the capacity for an annual (or regular) covid shot. And what if they can’t combine the flu and COVID shot? Will we need two annual vaccines spaced out?

what’s causing the lineups at some places? excess demand, lack of immunizers? my Family breezed through a pharmacy and mass clinic for our shots, but I know others wait in line for hours.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,186 Posts
Exactly, this is the reason why second dose is not so much important, it needs to be an upgraded with new variants booster, given to everyone in fall, other wise we will have winter no different from the last one.
... so you're banking on the notion that the first dose will cover you fully from the original virus, presumably still floating around? Or that the Covid virus are only the variants now?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
303 Posts
... so you're banking on the notion that the first dose will cover you fully from the original virus, presumably still floating around? Or that the Covid virus are only the variants now?
Well, the first dose might give me some protection theoretically, but then the Wuhan virus is constantly muting and it would make more sense instead getting the second shot with the same vaccine (already off by months from manufacture required scheduling) get the upgraded boost in fall. Anyhow in Ontario only 6% vaccinated.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,186 Posts
Well, the first dose might give me some protection theoretically, but then the Wuhan virus is constantly muting and it would make more sense instead getting the second shot with the same vaccine (already off by months from manufacture required scheduling) get the upgraded boost in fall. Anyhow in Ontario only 6% vaccinated.
... I'm not sure you're making sense here (aka your credibility) with the first dose giving you some protection "theoretically" on the Wuhan/KungFu/ChineseFlu, etc. virus?

Plus, what official timeline are you following that Ontario is only "6% vaccinated"??? Do you meant Ontario is only 6% "second-dose "vaccinated at this point in time? I think it's more than that ... start with healthcare workers, not just those in LTCs, but hospitals, dental clinics + private party healthcare providers, etc.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
303 Posts
... I'm not sure you're making sense here (aka your credibility) with the first dose giving you some protection "theoretically" on the Wuhan/KungFu/ChineseFlu, etc. virus?

Plus, what official timeline are you following that Ontario is only "6% vaccinated"??? Do you meant Ontario is only 6% "second-dose "vaccinated at this point in time? I think it's more than that ... start with healthcare workers, not just those in LTCs, but hospitals, dental clinics + private party healthcare providers, etc.
Yesterday was listening to CBC radio while driving and 6% was mentioned.
Why theoretically, because it is the retrospective game, and we assume the vaccine effectiveness based on the mutants that were circulating yesterday, while we should concentrating on developing vaccines effective against variants of tomorrow
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,186 Posts
Yesterday was listening to CBC radio while driving and 6% was mentioned.
Why theoretically, because it is the retrospective game, and we assume the vaccine effectiveness based on the mutants that were circulating yesterday, while we should concentrating on developing vaccines effective against variants of tomorrow
... ok. Since it's a restrospective game, then it isn't "theoretical" at all because it did happen. I think you're jumping way ahead of the game here and trying to make forecasts. You've to start somewhere with "a vaccine" and so far, it's working against the original mutant.

I believe Pfizer, et al are working on 'booster' shots to tackle the variants of tomorrow. Or are you still going by your 2023 theory on getting the vaccine (or the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, nth, etc. shot now)? You do realize that the shots don't cost you anything, at least not out of pocket for now.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,194 Posts

appears vaccines are less effective against Delta. Seems minister of health in Ontario let it slip that they may open up 2nd shots to all ages to try and get ahead of this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,186 Posts
^ What other choice do "we (including the "experts")" have at the moment to deal with Delta, Emma,. Gamma, Omega, etc.? Bleach? Wait ... we haven't tried the Jansen (or is it J&J) vaccine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,074 Posts
Yup.......I listened to an expert who said the vaccines have not been tested against the India virus at all, and the protection levels against death and "very serious" symptoms are reduced by the vaccines against the other variants. But.......he stressed that people can still get the virus and get pretty sick even if vaccinated. They likely won't die.......but it won't be much fun and they can also spread the virus. He said we have to continue to wear masks and more importantly........avoid close contact in crowds.

The Vietnam variant is also spreading and is classified by the Vietnamese as "very dangerous".........whatever that means.

The virus mutated much faster than scientists believed it could and would. It has outpaced our ability to deal with it.

Maybe that was some kind of "gain of function" developed in the Wuhan lab.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,074 Posts
Scientists don't like to admit they don't know the answer to something.

It makes for short interviews in the media, which is problematic for the scientists trying to raise research money.

What do you think will happen ?........asks the interviewer.

I have no idea........answers the scientist.

Thanks for the interview..........says the reporter ending the interview.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,074 Posts
Dr. Fauci (head of NIH).........to the best of my knowledge there has never been a lab leak of a virus.

Dr. Scott Gottlieb (former head of the FDA) ........there have been many lab leaks of viruses.

The general public.........huh ?

Protect yourself.........nobody else is going to do it for you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,186 Posts
exactly proves my point, if it isn’t/less effective against Indian variant, what is the point of the second shot with the same vaccine, just wait for the upgraded booster in fall.
... so what happens to all the 2nd dose (now useless) vaccines procured? Donate them to undeveloped-world countries waiting to get their first dose?

And in the meantime, prolonging the agony of "some" Canadians, screaming for mask, social distancing, lock-down restrictions, relief?

Whilst waiting for the booster shots ... against ... now the Vietnamese variant ... which country is next?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,186 Posts
Yup.......I listened to an expert who said the vaccines have not been tested against the India virus at all, and the protection levels against death and "very serious" symptoms are reduced by the vaccines against the other variants. But.......he stressed that people can still get the virus and get pretty sick even if vaccinated. They likely won't die.......but it won't be much fun and they can also spread the virus. He said we have to continue to wear masks and more importantly........avoid close contact in crowds.

The Vietnam variant is also spreading and is classified by the Vietnamese as "very dangerous".........whatever that means.

The virus mutated much faster than scientists believed it could and would. It has outpaced our ability to deal with it.

Maybe that was some kind of "gain of function" developed in the Wuhan lab.
... based on your thinking, I think we're doomed as a human species. Did China wanted this?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,074 Posts
China didn't "want" this, but it was arrogance that set it all in motion.

Only scientists possessing a high level of overconfidence in their own ability to control destiny would work on the most dangerous viruses in a laboratory that didn't deploy even the most basic security protection.

The lab in Wuhan wasn't much more secure than a high school chemistry classroom. Who thought that was good practice ?

Why would the US fund such a lab to do high level research ? What is the Canadian Winnipeg lab's connection to Wuhan ?

All the blame doesn't fall on just China.

The "gain of function" research in Wuhan was well known, just as it continues in labs in North America and around the world.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,378 Posts
I suppose. But 40% of the population 18+ getting one shot seems a little easier than the hoped-for 70-80% of the covid shot for 12+. I would think we would need double the capacity for an annual (or regular) covid shot. And what if they can’t combine the flu and COVID shot? Will we need two annual vaccines spaced out?

what’s causing the lineups at some places? excess demand, lack of immunizers? my Family breezed through a pharmacy and mass clinic for our shots, but I know others wait in line for hours.
" I would think we would need double the capacity for an annual (or regular) covid shot." I don't see why, we don't have problems administering that number of Flu shots. We didn't even have much trouble handling the massive influx with the last flu shot, despite the increased protocols due to COVID19.

I think the reason they're waiting in lines is because they didn't make appointments.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,634 Posts
I think the reason they're waiting in lines is because they didn't make appointments.
Yeah, I'm confused when I hear about lines.

For myself, I made an appointment for my 2 shots at specific dates and time. When I showed up for dose 1 at that date and time I went in and got my shot?

Lines maybe form if they have some sort of flash hot spot situation?

ltr
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13,951 Posts
"Mass clinics"? We routinely vaccinate 30-40% for flu shots. I'd expect COVID19 to be similar.


This whole "mass vaccination" thing seems silly, we had the highest flu shot takeup in years, and we were done everyone within 2 months. We're able to inject the vaccine faster than we can get it. If we got enough COVID19 vaccine we'd be done.

I think the media isn't helping this.
It will be much simpler if/when we have low levels of infection in the community. Right now, the deployment is requiring a lot of precautions and distancing, since COVID is so contagious (far more than flu).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20,727 Posts
It will be much simpler if/when we have low levels of infection in the community. Right now, the deployment is requiring a lot of precautions and distancing, since COVID is so contagious (far more than flu).
I've got to say that the mass vaccination clinic I went to in BC was kind of scary. It was a huge number of people flowing through -- kind of like a busy airport. Big lines, and lots of waiting in line with people all around you. The staff did enforce masks, and even provided masks and made people replace their flimsy cloth masks with good surgical masks (which was great), but I still wonder if those mass clinics might be spreading some COVID.

(Still amazing to me that people are using flimsy cloth masks at this point, since these offer minimal protection, and even disposable surgical masks are superior)

After I got vaccinated, I used a covid risk modeling tool to estimate the danger of this vaccination clinic based on the density of people. According to the modeling tool, the risk was quite low. The factors which brought the risk levels down were
  • low community rates of COVID around where I live
  • minimal talking in the facility (remember, don't talk or chit chat)
  • mostly 6 ft distance around me

Whenever you are in doubt, the easiest thing is to keep your mouth shut (don't talk) and maintain a 6 ft radius around you. I had an umbrella with me and kept pointing the sharp part of it behind me, to keep the clueless 20-something girl behind me from getting too close. She was playing a game on her phone and kept trying to come within spitting distance of me.
 
2521 - 2540 of 2585 Posts
Top