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Thanks. I've already switched my CGL.C holdings for MNT at the end of the day yesterday when the discount was -2.2%.
Geez was the discount that huge? Guess I missed it. I did look at one point and saw a very small discount but it wasn't even 1% so I didn't bother.

If you caught a 2.2% discount, good job.

Of course it's also possible for the discount to become even more negative.
 

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Good job, thanks for the headup, I am moving my PHYS over to MNT shortly.
Hope you were able to take a look today. Same for @hfp75 or others playing this premium-harvesting game.

At the moment you could make yourself the highest bidder (the first person who will get any trades) at 2.9% discount to NAV. Or even if you were impatient and bought at market, you'd still be buying at 2.6% discount.
 

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Hope you were able to take a look today. Same for @hfp75 or others playing this premium-harvesting game.

At the moment you could make yourself the highest bidder (the first person who will get any trades) at 2.9% discount to NAV. Or even if you were impatient and bought at market, you'd still be buying at 2.6% discount.
I've just switched the remaining CGL.C shares (18.823 avg. fill price) to MNT (22.309 avg. fill price) or around 3.4% discount. It was quite a game and it took about an hour to fill my complete MNT order, but it worked out okay at the end.

I bought my last 40 MNT shares at the ask price as I like to see MNT finish higher at the end of the day :)
 

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I've just switched the remaining CGL.C shares (18.823 avg. fill price) to MNT (22.309 avg. fill price) or around 3.4% discount. It was quite a game and it took about an hour to fill my complete MNT order, but it worked out okay at the end.

I bought my last 40 MNT shares at the ask price as I like to see MNT finish higher at the end of the day :)
Congrats! I tried bottom fishing that discount at -2%, but you got a better discount. I suppose the danger is that the discount might remain for a long time.

But it's pretty clear these shares are going to act the same way Central Fund of Canada used to behave. When gold is unpopular, there's selling pressure, and a discount. When gold is popular, there's buying pressure, and a premium.

I used to "harvest" this effect the same way on CEF. But it does require an understanding that the sentiment on gold does change, and that premium/discount cycle will span many years. MNT actually is like a 'closed end fund', since it holds a static amount of bullion. Nothing too mysterious about this.
 

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Congrats! I tried bottom fishing that discount at -2%, but you got a better discount. I suppose the danger is that the discount might remain for a long time.

But it's pretty clear these shares are going to act the same way Central Fund of Canada used to behave. When gold is unpopular, there's selling pressure, and a discount. When gold is popular, there's buying pressure, and a premium.

I used to "harvest" this effect the same way on CEF. But it does require an understanding that the sentiment on gold does change, and that premium/discount cycle will span many years. MNT actually is like a 'closed end fund', since it holds a static amount of bullion. Nothing too mysterious about this.
The MNT discount is again -3.3% in case someone missed out. I've switched all my gold holdings to MNT. Such discounts are rare and usually MNT trades at a premium.
Last time when I've switched to CGL.C, the MNT premium was above 10%. Also, I have submitted my 2020 tax return and CRA did not object my capital loss for switching between MNT and CGL.C.
So, I think they are not "identical properties" even thought they both hold gold in Can $, there are too many differences and the investors are not indifferent holding one or the other.
 

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I have submitted my 2020 tax return and CRA did not object my capital loss for switching between MNT and CGL.C.
So, I think they are not "identical properties" even thought they both hold gold in Can $, there are too many differences and the investors are not indifferent holding one or the other.
I doubt very much that CRA would object to this -- or, indeed, even examine the issue -- before issuing a NOA. It doesn't mean the CRA can't one day revisit the claim for a capital loss.

I am particularly interested in this issue because I switched from one to the other this year within 61 days. I figure I have a superficial loss and plan on adding that to my ACB for my current holding.
But I would love to hear/read something definitive about the tax treatment for this switch.
 

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I doubt very much that CRA would object to this -- or, indeed, even examine the issue -- before issuing a NOA. It doesn't mean the CRA can't one day revisit the claim for a capital loss.

I am particularly interested in this issue because I switched from one to the other this year within 61 days. I figure I have a superficial loss and plan on adding that to my ACB for my current holding.
But I would love to hear/read something definitive about the tax treatment for this switch.
CRA have issued the NOA and did not object to my capital loss claim. I was also planning to add the superficial loss to my ACB, but decided to try and see if they will object.
I am also considering switching between CGL (instead of CGL.C) and MNT, which are definitely not identical. The small movement of the CAD/USD exchange rate would not make a significant difference in the MNT premium/discount harvesting. Also, running the numbers here are the Standard Deviations and other relevant parameters for MNT, CGL, CGL.C since Jan 2020.
As you can see below CGL has the highest Sharpe ratio (best risk/reward) for the period amongst the Gold funds. Of course the bitcoin fund was way better, but who knew:

TickerTotal ReturnAvg Ret/dayVarianceStd DevCorr SPYBetaMax DDownVol/yearRisk-Adj vs SPYSharpeCAGR
SPY
30.83%​
0.10%​
0.03635%​
1.91%​
1.00​
1.00​
-33.72%​
30.27%​
0.00%​
0.053​
23.26%​
QBTC
284.23%​
1.27%​
0.31453%​
5.61%​
0.07​
0.31​
-30.59%​
89.03%​
34.51%​
0.227​
1556.91%​
MNT
9.57%​
0.05%​
0.03589%​
1.89%​
0.13​
0.13​
-32.51%​
30.07%​
-11.12%​
0.024​
7.37%​
CGL.C
10.69%​
0.04%​
0.01484%​
1.22%​
0.04​
0.03​
-22.78%​
19.34%​
-7.40%​
0.032​
8.22%​
CGL
13.91%​
0.05%​
0.01532%​
1.24%​
0.11​
0.07​
-19.24%​
19.65%​
-4.93%​
0.039​
10.66%​
CADUSD
3.64%​
0.01%​
0.00289%​
0.54%​
0.03​
0.01​
-10.58%​
8.54%​
-9.40%​
0.023​
2.82%​
 

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The MNT discount is roughly 0% today and gold appears to be strengthening. I'm pretty happy about my rotation into it back at the 2% discount.

Kind of makes me wonder how many times I can do this between CGL.C & MNT
 

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I swapped back to mnt a while ago at par, but I recently rebalanced and enjoyed the discount at -2.5%.

One day in the future I hope to enjoy another 10% free cash.....
 

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Thought I would let potential buyers be aware that right now MNT is a discount ! This product doesnt usually trade on this much of a discount.

-4.63%

It may still suffer & the discount could even get larger. There is no way to know how to predict this BUT a year ago there was a double digit premium on this....
 

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Thought I would let potential buyers be aware that right now MNT is a discount ! This product doesnt usually trade on this much of a discount.

-4.63%

It may still suffer & the discount could even get larger. There is no way to know how to predict this BUT a year ago there was a double digit premium on this....
I already move all my gold position to MNT, and I am out of room in my TFSA, so no luck for me here :(
 

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Thought I would let potential buyers be aware that right now MNT is a discount ! This product doesnt usually trade on this much of a discount.

-4.63%

It may still suffer & the discount could even get larger. There is no way to know how to predict this BUT a year ago there was a double digit premium on this....
I've also moved all my gold positions to MNT. Currently it is trading at -3.54% discount. It's is very rare the MNT discount drops below 3%, so this is a good opportunity if someone is looking to switch to MNT.
 
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