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Discussion Starter #1
New measures in Ontario. Stay-at-home orders. Media is all over it saying nothing has changed. Others saying big boxes are being treated preferentially. I find the media is just making it more confusing.

what big-boxes are open that don’t sell groceries? None that I know of. If you’re a small business owner selling groceries, you’re allowed to be open. To me, it’s more essential vs non-essential. Not big box vs small business. The only change I would make is to limit aisles to food only in Costco and Walmart.

why does the media keep trying to find loopholes or obscure ways to “get around” the rules?

just stay home...go out for food, exercise, medication, medical appointments.
 

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New measures in Ontario. Stay-at-home orders. Media is all over it saying nothing has changed. Others saying big boxes are being treated preferentially. I find the media is just making it more confusing.

what big-boxes are open that don’t sell groceries? None that I know of. If you’re a small business owner selling groceries, you’re allowed to be open. To me, it’s more essential vs non-essential. Not big box vs small business. The only change I would make is to limit aisles to food only in Costco and Walmart.

why does the media keep trying to find loopholes or obscure ways to “get around” the rules?

just stay home...go out for food, exercise, medication, medical appointments.
Some people like to complain.
Realistically there isn't much more they can do.
 

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New measures in Ontario. Stay-at-home orders. Media is all over it saying nothing has changed. Others saying big boxes are being treated preferentially. I find the media is just making it more confusing.

what big-boxes are open that don’t sell groceries? None that I know of. If you’re a small business owner selling groceries, you’re allowed to be open. To me, it’s more essential vs non-essential. Not big box vs small business. The only change I would make is to limit aisles to food only in Costco and Walmart.

why does the media keep trying to find loopholes or obscure ways to “get around” the rules?

just stay home...go out for food, exercise, medication, medical appointments.
.. not sure what media you're referring to. I think the news (media) are reporting what people (including those from the government itself) are finding the new lock-down measures confusing.

Is a skating rink an outdoor gathering? New Ontario rules present questions, Tory says

Even TO's no-teeth mayor needs clarification re issues in above link.
 

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It’s very simple in my mind....stay home
... I would agree based on use of common sense but then some people don't have that. And there are the special people who likes to complicate things.
 

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I suspect that will be the case. They'll probably cordon off other areas, or move displays accordingly. They did that in Quebec.
.. and Wally / Costy didn't b1tch (yet) in Quebec? Worst ... planning a lawsuit. Is that the scare tactic?

Just a quick search on CP24 showed Mississauga's mayor (on November 25, 2020=2 and a half months ago!!!) wanted this scenario.

Mississauga wants to limit sales of non-essential items at big box stores

And yet tomorrow's "new" lockdown doesn't even address or include this.

What do the mayors (plus bloated city staff) of Ontario's city/towns do all day, except working-so-hard zooming-all-day-at-home? I really like to know.
 

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The latest announcements are ineffective but give the government political cover to say they "took action".
 

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Really with businesses now having to close earlier and people allowed to go out for exercise; takeout; groceries; RX's, and curbside pickup the Stay @Home order is pointless. The reduced open hours is one change so the stay @home order is just icing on the cake and sounds impressive for them to announce.
 

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what big-boxes are open that don’t sell groceries? None that I know of.
Depends on what open means. Home Depot, Lowes, CT etc are open for pick up. They sell non-essentials. We are supposed to stay at home except when shopping for essentials, so who will be shopping there?

Same with liquor/beer stores - they are now likely curbside only? But if they are non-essential we should not go out to pick up?

Rules say there is no restriction on buying non-essentials. But if we must stay at home, how do we buy them? On-Line?

The rules released are all over the map, so no wonder public are confused.
 

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^
Rules say there is no restriction on buying non-essentials. But if we must stay at home, how do we buy them? On-Line?
... that or curbside pick up. Ie. no in-person or inside-the-store buying non-essential stuffs. Or Ford's begging Ontarians to stay-at-home as much as possible. Only go out for "essentials". [And please no redefining what's considered essentials]

The rules released are all over the map, so no wonder public are confused.
. ... I think the (still) weak enforcement is the problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Depends on what open means. Home Depot, Lowes, CT etc are open for pick up. They sell non-essentials. We are supposed to stay at home except when shopping for essentials, so who will be shopping there?

Same with liquor/beer stores - they are now likely curbside only? But if they are non-essential we should not go out to pick up?

Rules say there is no restriction on buying non-essentials. But if we must stay at home, how do we buy them? On-Line?

The rules released are all over the map, so no wonder public are confused.
I think how we define essential is the issue. I agree with what was said today.......what is essential for me, can be non-essential for others. ex. My toilet breaks, or I need a fuse for my furnace, or I need to replace a flat tire. I’m fine with “big-boxes” or any other retailer selling curb-side.
 

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IMO curbside pickup is a good thing.
I'm stuck at home, maybe I want to finish off that reno project. I've got time, I should do that.
 

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Unless they close warehouse type of stores ( like Costco, Walmart, superstore, etc), cases will never come down. they should have done this from the beginning.. local Costco is full of people and most of the time they buy items that are not related to essential items. no wonder Costco/Walmarts are made a lot of money during the pandemic.
 

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Unless they close warehouse type of stores ( like Costco, Walmart, superstore, etc), cases will never come down. they should have done this from the beginning.. local Costco is full of people and most of the time they buy items that are not related to essential items. no wonder Costco/Walmarts are made a lot of money during the pandemic.
I'm not so sure about that.
I think it's people interacting more that is causing the numbers to spike.

I think work & in home gatherings are spreading. I'm not so sure it's stores where people are properly masked.
 

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The larger amount of infections and almost all ICU infections come from these 3 culprits.

1) Social Gatherings
2) Workplaces
3) Vehicles: Only reason no one cites vehicles is because they are usually part of either social gathering or car pooling to work.

Stopping any other areas of infection will be insignificant to the goal of reducing the current rate of infection.
 
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