Canadian Money Forum banner
41 - 60 of 90 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #41 ·
What happen if people from certain ethnic backgrounds are overwhelmed the victims, should there be a program target for that ethnic background ?
No, that would be "racist".
I think it's racist and lazy to assume that a particular racial/ethnic group is a monolith of experiences.

Just to be clear, I am simply arguing for a separation between the experience that we should help.
I am arguing against the racist assumption that the entire race or ethnic group has suffered that experience.

The fact that not everyone in a particular group has had the same experience should be obvious.
For example, The Obamas are black, their children are among the most privileged people in the country.
I think it is hard to suggest that they need additional support to make up for inter generational racism.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
No, that would be "racist".
I think it's racist and lazy to assume that a particular racial/ethnic group is a monolith of experiences.

Just to be clear, I am simply arguing for a separation between the experience that we should help.
I am arguing against the racist assumption that the entire race or ethnic group has suffered that experience.

The fact that not everyone in a particular group has had the same experience should be obvious.
For example, The Obamas are black, their children are among the most privileged people in the country.
I think it is hard to suggest that they need additional support to make up for inter generational racism.
You haven't quite answer my question, minority is in more difficult financial and education footing, these things are measurable, in fact, I am currently working with Stat Canada to help gather those information.

We can certainly put clause in AA saying people that are too wealthy, or have too much income are not eligible for assistance.

BTW, I oppose quota system because we strife to be a meritocracy, so anyone that get move to higher ground are suppose to be qualify, so my vision of AA is to improve education for minority in order to increase the amount of qualify candidate for the position of leadership among minorities.

Although I do agree, some of those problems with specific minority are self inflicted. For example, East Asian immigrants are know to be model immigrants because they have massive focus on education. Many other minorities frown at studying, which pave their way for failure in a service base economy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #43 ·
You haven't quite answer my question, minority is in more difficult financial and education footing, these things are measurable, in fact, I am currently working with Stat Canada to help gather those information.
I don't understand your question then.

We can certainly put clause in AA saying people that are too wealthy, or have too much income are not eligible for assistance.
Sure, but why don't we remove the racial component, and simply help those who need help?


Although I do agree, some of those problems with specific minority are self inflicted. For example, East Asian immigrants are know to be model immigrants because they have massive focus on education. Many other minorities frown at studying, which pave their way for failure in a service base economy.
Well that's culture and not race, and some cultures are better than others.
For example I think sexist cultures are inferior.

Really, why not make a system that helps those who need it?
Unless you're a racist, that should be a non factor, it isn't like all people of race X need help.

That's the part I don't get, I can accept all the desire to help people improve, and help people who were injured. I just see no reason to link it to race. Why does race matter so much to people?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #44 · (Edited)
It seems that a lot of people want to assume common characteristics of a race and treat them differently because of that.
This is racism, and this is what I oppose.

Some of the arguments for racism are.
1. lack of education.
I don't dispute that some people have lower quality than others.
I don't dispute that people within a certain demographic group may have different levels of education than others.
In this case I suggest addressing the education differential directly, as opposed to treating the entire demographic group differently.

I simply don't think there is really any justification to treat a racial group differently.
Every time someone comes up with a reason, it seems you can simply look at the issue and address it directly, there really seems to be no reason to bring race into it.

I draw a very strong distinction between race, and the experiences of the people who make up the race, AND the cultures, beliefs and actions of those people.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,619 Posts
Your theory that racism can be eliminated by treating everyone the same has failed for over 100 years.

Legislation and programs were introduced to compensate for the failure of that theory.

"All men are created equal" was penned 200 years ago and it wasn't until the 1960's that black people obtained some measure of equality.

In Canada our legacy isn't as long or dire......but the history and timeline is much the same.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,619 Posts
One thing we can do to eliminate racism is to vote for political candidates who disavow policies that continue racism.

I strategically vote for the candidate best able to defeat the political candidates who don't recognize racism as a systemic problem.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #47 ·
Your theory that racism can be eliminated by treating everyone the same has failed for over 100 years.

Legislation and programs were introduced to compensate for the failure of that theory.

"All men are created equal" was penned 200 years ago and it wasn't until the 1960's that black people obtained some measure of equality.

In Canada our legacy isn't as long or dire......but the history and timeline is much the same.
It hasn't failed for over 100 years, because it hasn't been tried for over 100 years.
Even today we have white supremacists in government pushing racism (Trudeau)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #48 ·
One thing we can do to eliminate racism is to vote for political candidates who disavow policies that continue racism.

I strategically vote for the candidate best able to defeat the political candidates who don't recognize racism as a systemic problem.
Absolutely, I just hope enough people agree with this approach to get Trudeau out of office.
He is the most powerful racist in the country.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
537 Posts
Your theory that racism can be eliminated by treating everyone the same has failed for over 100 years.

Legislation and programs were introduced to compensate for the failure of that theory.

"All men are created equal" was penned 200 years ago and it wasn't until the 1960's that black people obtained some measure of equality.

In Canada our legacy isn't as long or dire......but the history and timeline is much the same.
His theory isn't to treat everyone the same.
His theory is to provide help for those who need help.
If more people of certain race need help, than more people from that race will receive help.
They will receive help because they need it, not because they are of certain race.

Where is a single issue with that thinking?
Unless you actually believe like our current government does that if you are of a certain race then you are automatically incapable and need help just based on the fact that you are of a certain race?

I personally don't believe that people are inherently inferior because of their race.
Our government seems to believe that. Therefore, our government is racist.
Are you racist as well?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
112 Posts
I just want to ask how can people effectively separate culture with race ?
Isn't certain culture effectively only have a specific race ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #51 ·
I just want to ask how can people effectively separate culture with race ?
Isn't certain culture effectively only have a specific race ?
Culture is beliefs and actions.
Race is genetics.

Lets take "white people" as a race.
There is a big difference in culture between Trailer Trash, and British Royalty, despite the racial similarities.

I do think that there is of course a correlation between race and culture.
Many actually want to mix them, however they are dramatically different.

Some cultures are bad, they simply are, they have crappy values, beliefs and behaviours that lead to poor outcomes. Some have good values that lead to good outcomes.
Also it's politically incorrect to say that some cultures are better.

What gets messy is when you treat someone differently based on the culture or image they project.
But this is WHY people present themselves a certain way.

I wear a suit, or shirt and dress pants to work.
When someone shows up to a professional interview like a slob, you judge that image they're presenting.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,619 Posts
Legislation against racism and discrimination has been in place for long time. Individual rights have been legislated for even longer.

And yet, here we are years later and racism and discrimination still exist. Continuing on the same path and expecting to end up in a different place is foolish.

This important work will continue without assistance from the non-progressive types. They are always rowing the boat in the wrong direction anyways.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #53 · (Edited)
Legislation against racism and discrimination has been in place for long time. Individual rights have been legislated for even longer.

And yet, here we are years later and racism and discrimination still exist. Continuing on the same path and expecting to end up in a different place is foolish.

This important work will continue without assistance from the non-progressive types. They are always rowing the boat in the wrong direction anyways.
You say this, but then you support a regressive racist like Trudeau.
I think if we fix the consitution to actually make racial discrimination illegal, that would be a good start.

We have legal racism, and political leaders encouraging it. Of course racism still exists, our tax dollars are literally funding it.
If the government stopped promoting it, I think it would die out quicker.

Also racial discrimination is not nearly as bad as it was a generation or two ago.
Really it's only the socialists supporting racism.

Also where is all this racism, I'm not racist, I don't actually know anyone who is.
I've run into a few, I've seen people like Trudeau on TV, but in real life, it's just not that common.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,619 Posts
Do you expect racists to goose step down the street with torches, shouting....Jews will not replace us ?

That isn't going to hap.....wait a minute......it did happen.

Do you expect police officers to openly kneel on a black person's neck until they die, beat them to death, or shoot them ?

That isn't going to hap......wait a minute....it did happen.

Time to wake from your slumber........Mr. Matt Van Winkle.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
537 Posts
Yes. There were racists walking down the street.
Yes, there is racist sitting in prime minister's office.

You will never eliminate all racists, although most of us wish we could.
You can however make racist action unconstitutional and illegal.
So that racists walking down the street and the racist sitting in prime ministers office will not be allowed to legally commit racist acts.

Why do you always distort other people's posts?
Matt is not saying that racists will disappear,
He wants to make racism actions illegal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #56 ·
Do you expect police officers to openly kneel on a black person's neck until they die, beat them to death, or shoot them ?

That isn't going to hap......wait a minute....it did happen.

Time to wake from your slumber........Mr. Matt Van Winkle.
Did you sleep through the part where that behaviour, of an individual person, was widely condemned by everyone?

People generally don't approve of racism. That's the norm.

It's only white supremacists like Trudeau pushing for racism, and deniers like you saying racial discrimination isn't racist.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,609 Posts
Yes. There were racists walking down the street.
Yes, there is racist sitting in prime minister's office.

You will never eliminate all racists, although most of us wish we could.
You can however make racist action unconstitutional and illegal.
So that racists walking down the street and the racist sitting in prime ministers office will not be allowed to legally commit racist acts.

Why do you always distort other people's posts?
Matt is not saying that racists will disappear,
He wants to make racism actions illegal.
... perhaps in a dream or in some la-la-land that doesn't exist on this planet.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,932 Posts
Discussion Starter · #58 ·
... perhaps in a dream or in some la-la-land that doesn't exist on this planet.
What dream that doesn't exist?
damianstar summarized it simply.

I'd like racist acts to be made illegal, and those laws to be enforced. Ideally they should start at the PMO and work their way down.

I know that's a dream, but "I have a dream"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,609 Posts
What dream that doesn't exist?
damianstar summarized it simply.

I'd like racist acts to be made illegal, and those laws to be enforced. Ideally they should start at the PMO and work their way down.

I know that's a dream, but "I have a dream"
... a dream ≠ reality. Spin it however you like.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
537 Posts
... a dream ≠ reality. Spin it however you like.
So what you are saying is that expecting racist action to be illegal in Canada is just a dream that has zero chance of ever materializing?
I thought it is very reasonable expectation to have and relatively easy to implement if there was political will
 
41 - 60 of 90 Posts
Top