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Discussion Starter #1
I didn't see a thread on this and I thought there would be one.

I am looking at the messaging from the candidates and there is little regarding financial/economic policy from any of them. The uniform message is "The libs are spending too much and a conservative govt with X at the helm would spend less". Personally I don't find that messaging especially compelling as a leadership bid from any of them.

I can't see any chance of victory from any but MacKay. Is there anything but social factors to separate them? At the mo, I think I will support MacKay, but I'm wondering if there are significant policy elements from any of them that persuade others.
 

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I am looking at the messaging from the candidates and there is little regarding financial/economic policy from any of them. The uniform message is "The libs are spending too much and a conservative govt with X at the helm would spend less". Personally I don't find that messaging especially compelling as a leadership bid from any of them.
Hasn't that always been their platform? "Our policy is we're not the Liberals". I don't think they ever post a compelling book of policies in past elections. Or rather, at the last minute before the election, they'll update their website with a "platform".
 

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I guess the big problem here is whether you want the candidate that can best beat Trudeau or the candidate you most support. Sometimes you have to bite your lip I suppose.

I have no use for two of the candidates. Leslyn Lewis is a staunch religious social conservative who's main agenda appears to be anti-abortion and pro-life (sigh). She claims she would increase government funding for crisis pregnancy centers (which counsel women against abortion), and she would end foreign aid funding for abortion. She endorses pro-life advocacy groups including the Campaign Life Coalition (sheesh). She is focused on gathering support among religious social conservatives and pro-life groups. It seems to be the top of her agenda. Reports say that even though she won’t be marching in any Pride parades, she said she wouldn’t change gay marriage laws, although, “My personal view as a Christian is that marriage is between a man and a woman,” she said. I'm sure the gays are thrilled with this candidate after all the progress they've made over the years in the Conservative party. This woman is a non-starter who wants to back it all off. She said she has a problem with legalizing recreational marijuana use. That's a position that will absolutely lose you votes in the next election against Trudeau. Asked if legalization should be rolled back, she said “that’s something I would consider". Doesn't she realize why Trudeau got elected?

Derek Sloan is a social conservative. But even that may be putting it mildly. He wears his religion prominently on his sleeve as was evident in the debates – he’s opposed to abortion and gay rights – he’s promised to re-open the abortion debate and repeal amendments to the human rights code including gender identity and gender expression as grounds for discrimination. He bills himself as a “Conservative without apology” , but from everything I've seen this appears to be to simply draw attention to himself.

So that leaves Erin O'Toole and Peter MacKay as the only legitimate candidates. Here the question isn't their platforms, rather who can win.

Myself, I would rather O'Toole, but I think MacKay has the best chance to beat Trudeau, so there's nothing left to discuss as we need to save our country from the Liberal scourge.

I vote Peter MacKay.

ltr
 

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I believe Derek Sloan is also in favor of conversion therapy, which I find abhorrent.

I agree that O'Toole and MacKay are the only two with a shot.
 

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Except for the raise in pay and living in the official opposition residence for free, with free housekeepers, chefs and drivers.......I don't know why anyone would want to lead the Conservatives.

Whomever wins faces the dilemna that the Conservative Party won't change it's policies and can't win with the policies they have.

Even with all the perks........Rona Ambrose didn't want to tackle that problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Conservative Party won't change it's policies and can't win with the policies they have
I'm not sure about whether they need to or can change many policies significantly, but I do feel that they're unlikely to win any upcoming election, at least for a year or so. I think any party would be insane to trigger an election before the dust settles around COVID.

I think whoever is the next leader is likely to lose the next general election, and be kicked out afterwards like Scheer. The interesting potential candidates, like Ambrose or Baird are sitting this round out. I'm sorry to see the party that improved its position greatly, and came close to forming a government apparently just cave in on itself.

There's talk that if MacKay wins it will trigger a schism with the religious right taking their ball and forming some new, irrelevant vote sink. I'm not sure that would be entirely bad, but it would cut them off from some of the traditional base. It would be hell for all the sitting conservative members.
 

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I can't imagine ever voting Conservatives as long as they stick with this social conservatism and religious right stuff.

These current Conservatives keep hoping everyone will forget that they are really Reform / Alliance, a party focused on Alberta's interests. The original Progressive Conservatives existed from 1942 - 2003 but that ended in 2003. They don't exist today.
 

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For all the talk of wexit because Alberta hardly voted for Liberals, no one seems to be taking about the fact that CPC vote share in the Atlantic was as low as LPC vote share in Alberta. Maybe CPC should deal with that alienation...
 

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Seems to me that, in typical Conservative Party style, the knives will be out and sharpened days after the new leader is announced. Hard to imagine but this is really two parties...Reform and Red Tory.

I would like to see a very strong Conservative Party. Scheer has been worse than a total bust. Now, we have second stringers running. Plus two no hopers. The Party's heavy hitters decided, probably for good reason, to sit this one out. Until the Party decides that they want to be one unified Party I cannot see any of these first rate candidates in waiting even consider entering a race to become leader.

Not good for Canada IMHO. We are being left with very poor choices.
 

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For all the talk of wexit because Alberta hardly voted for Liberals, no one seems to be taking about the fact that CPC vote share in the Atlantic was as low as LPC vote share in Alberta. Maybe CPC should deal with that alienation...
I don't think the Reform/Alliance party resonates much outside of Alberta. I deliberately am not saying 'western provinces' because that means BC, AB, SK, MB.

The more surprising part to me is that this Alberta-focused political movement was able to get so many votes in Ontario, previously.
 

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I don't think the Reform/Alliance party resonates much outside of Alberta. I deliberately am not saying 'western provinces' because that means BC, AB, SK, MB.

The more surprising part to me is that this Alberta-focused political movement was able to get so many votes in Ontario, previously.
Stephen Harper was a very capable and competent leader. Nobody was really thrilled with him, but pretty much everyone had to accept that he was doing a pretty good job all things considered.
That's all I want from my goverment, just do your job well, and leave me alone.
 

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Stephen Harper was a very capable and competent leader. Nobody was really thrilled with him, but pretty much everyone had to accept that he was doing a pretty good job all things considered.
That's all I want from my goverment, just do your job well, and leave me alone.
No question he was competent and capable. I just did not like his (and many other party members') values.
 

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No question he was competent and capable. I just did not like his (and many other party members') values.
But I think that's why Harper was able to keep the party on track as well as he did.

Even if they disagreed with him on an issue, they knew that he'd deliver an acceptable trade off.
I'm not confident Mackay can do that.
 

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I don't know how Harper deserves much praise.

He completely alienated Atlantic Canada with his attacks on seasonal workers (unemployment benefits) and the Conservatives have paid for it since.

The Harper government immediately cancelled the tax cuts for low income workers and treated military veterans shamefully.(see Juian Fantino)

Then there was his government's terrible response to the Syrian refugee crisis. Who can forget the mess they made of that ? (see Chris Alexander)

Sorry.......but Conservatives are trying to rewrite history. Canadians remembered and that is why the "guy with the nice hair" kicked Harper's butt.

Reporter Christine Blizzard tried to rewrite the history of Ontario's Mike Harris too. That didn't sell well.

Message to Conservatives.......Don't treat voters like idiots. They know what happened.
 

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For Canada, Trudeau is the right man for the job. In Ontario, Doug Ford is the right man for the job.

They both have some faults, but they are doing the best they can and are effective.

And more importantly, they are working hand in hand together....and that is impressive. Both are enjoying high popularity in the polls.

Ford doesn't have the time or tolerance for the constant whiners in the Conservative Party. He wouldn't even campaign or meet with Andrew Scheer.

Maybe someday he will run for the PC leadership.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
In Ontario, Doug Ford is the right man for the job.
I don't agree. I think Christine Elliott was the right one. Ford's an idiot. But this COVID business has snapped him out of his vindictive crusade against the Toronto city council and made him actually do his job and, miraculously, he is not totally incompetent.

Maybe someday he will run for the PC leadership.
You mean national Conservative Party leadership? Gosh, I hope not. I do not think he would be a good choice at all.
 

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I don't agree. I think Christine Elliott was the right one. Ford's an idiot. But this COVID business has snapped him out of his vindictive crusade against the Toronto city council and made him actually do his job and, miraculously, he is not totally incompetent.

You mean national Conservative Party leadership? Gosh, I hope not. I do not think he would be a good choice at all.
Christine Elliott comes across much more polished.
Doug Ford doesn't, but that isn't the point. He has leadership, he knows how to set priorities, and let people do their job.

As far as being vindictive against Toronto city council, there should be some lingering animosity there. When you have people come at you and your family personally, yeah you'll want to lash back. Their behavior was an abuse of the democratic process.
 

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Is every politician a crook or an incompetent boob or do we expect too much? I see comments all the time from people who expect politicians to do the impossible as if they had some magic wand that suspended all laws including the laws of physics and economics. I wish the public could know the truth about what is possible and what is not and scale back their demands. In the end we would be far better off with realistic policies and laws rather than trying to do the impossible and failing.
 
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