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I can't say I have a lot of interest in the topic, living out in the boonies, but I nonetheless appreciate GreatLaker's scholarly dissertation.
 

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All the high level medical advice says airborne transmission is very low risk and close proximity only where droplets transfer. I mean if there was any serious airborne potential they would have had a 10m-50m buffer, not a 2m one. IMO, you're overthinking this but it's your call.
Sounds like you're assuming the current 2m buffer was determined by a medical "methodology" in the first place...

More like it was some government ministers chatting about --- soo 10m? --- No that's crazy! --- OK 1m? --- Hey take this seriously! --- Fine, 2m? --- Perfect! Just think how nice and proportionate all the signs and posters we spend $50M on will look!
 

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Discussion Starter #23
I agree with @peterk ... there is a lot of guesswork happening right now. I think health experts provide guidance, but they are guessing too. There was no time for controlled studies on these matters and we know very little about some of these matters.

I think it's worth being overly cautious at this point, because we still know so little. How airborne is this thing? I'd rather be safe than sorry.

Being cautious means things like mask usage, keeping lots of distance, and getting fresh air (not confined air) whenever possible.
 

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Sounds like you're assuming the current 2m buffer was determined by a medical "methodology" in the first place...
I'd imagine it is and I don't know why you'd think otherwise but you're free to make your own assessment.
 

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Except you did make it up. At least, you put a spin on the story, so let's look at the facts from the story:
1. CO2 is used primarily for drink carbonation and some food packaging to keep it sterile;
2. CO2 is generated as an ethanol by-product;
3. The Trump administration made exemptions so that gas refineries didn't have to blend ethanol, resulting in a crash in the ethanol market (more here: Trump's billion-dollar gambit: An ethanol deal to meet the demands of farmers and Big Oil);
4. Flood of cheap oil made ended up reducing the market for domestic oil, reducing the ethanol market even more; and
5. People start driving less due to COVID 19, so the market demands shrink even more.

But yes, let's blame it on COVID 19, and not the other 2 main factors that disrupted the ethanol market demand.
 

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I agree with @peterk ... there is a lot of guesswork happening right now. I think health experts provide guidance, but they are guessing too. There was no time for controlled studies on these matters and we know very little about some of these matters.

I think it's worth being overly cautious at this point, because we still know so little. How airborne is this thing? I'd rather be safe than sorry.

Being cautious means things like mask usage, keeping lots of distance, and getting fresh air (not confined air) whenever possible.
LOL, maybe the thing to do rather than buying a condo then is to look at buying and living in a tent pitched in the middle of a field or forest in that case.
 

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Best I can tell is every building built since circa 1970 (and some before it) has pressurized corridors (positive pressure) such that there is no cross-contamination between units. The original purpose of this was to prevent, for example, cooking odours from one unit infiltrating other units.The first high rise we lived in, in 1971 in Mt Pleasant/Eglinton in Toronto had positive pressure, as did our second place at Scarlett Rd/Eglinton in Etobicoke.. My undestanding is these positive pressure systems bring in 'make up' fresh air with either zero or minimal recirculation from lobbies and corridors.

I would be a lot more worried about surface contamination of door handles and elevator buttons, or even sharing an elevator with other residents.
 

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I'd imagine it is and I don't know why you'd think otherwise but you're free to make your own assessment.
Yes I will, and I don't know why you WOULD imagine that it is.

How far does a cough, sneeze or moisture droplets from breath travel? 2m? Sure, maybe. Sounds low to me...
How wide are grocery store aisles? 2m
How far do you have to be apart before having a conversation is difficult? 2m
What makes for a good easy to read sign? 2 stick people separated by 2m

It's obviously just "the number" that was picked, likely as a compromise between competing desires among political influencers, and ultimately decided by someone based on those competing factors, practicality, and political calculation.

Same with the 50 > 15 > 5 people gatherings ban. Whatever sounds good and whatever is politically tenable for the particular politician who is trying to either convey that he is "taking this virus seriously" or that he is "sensitive to people's need for community and togetherness". Based on absolutely nothing other than "that sounds about right".

James, if you are so worried (I'm not FWIW), then I think this is the time to spend your money and rent a house. Your portfolio is up up up, you are successfully working contracts in your new career, all other living expenses are low. Rent the damn house, spend an extra 10-20k or whatever it costs over-and-above a little apartment, and live contently and isolated for the next 12 months until this is all past us. You are rich. There is absolutely no reason you need to expose yourself to dense, urban, box living like millions of people who have no choice in the matter and are just scraping by on temporary CERB.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
@peterk I'm not actually that worried either. I'm in an age group that has few deaths from COVID-19. Just trying to be careful. Apartments can be OK, and as I mentioned up thread, I'm convinced that my last apt's ventilation system was safe. If I was still living there right now, I'd be OK with it.

Generally, I'm trying to optimize for 'good quality of life under normal circumstances'. I am not concerned enough to restructure my life around COVID-19. This is why I'm looking for an apartment in a city I like, even with the dense population. I'm generally planning for normal times.

I'm not rich, and can't afford renting a house as a single person. My contract income is extremely volatile.

Caution never hurt anyone. Being cautious is different than re-arranging everything due to risk.
 

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Yes I will, and I don't know why you WOULD imagine that it is.

How far does a cough, sneeze or moisture droplets from breath travel? 2m? Sure, maybe. Sounds low to me...
How wide are grocery store aisles? 2m
How far do you have to be apart before having a conversation is difficult? 2m
What makes for a good easy to read sign? 2 stick people separated by 2m

It's obviously just "the number" that was picked, likely as a compromise between competing desires among political influencers, and ultimately decided by someone based on those competing factors, practicality, and political calculation.
I doubt it was just "picked" but rather a reasonable safety distance many could understand. Actually, many have said 1 meter over the course of the pandemic but that likely increases your chances of contact (bumping into,brushing clothes,etc) with others to much so generally 2m is stated as a buffer.

Yes if someone does cough, sneeze, etc at you within 2 meters (or more) you are pretty much doomed, it will travel farther. But what is more likely, having someone do that when you are out shopping or picking up the virus from contact? If 100 people have walked down a shopping aisle before you and one of them sneezes they infect all the products 2-4m in front of them with the spray. IMO, product (or common contact points) like this are a much greater threat and not direct transfer like a sneeze or cough within 2m of you.
 
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