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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Anybody invest in alternative investment types of things ?

Sports cards, art, wine, history artifacts, autographs, stamps, coins, celebrities, authentic movie artifacts......?

It is stunning what vintage collectibles are selling for these days.

Pick a collectible and check out the prices. The company is very reputable and ranks with Sotheby's and others, but more on the collectible side.

It is an interesting website to browse away some time.

 

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The few people I know that have these collections that are worth anything are those that collected the item purely for their own enjoyment/interest. They were fanatics in the things they were collecting and could make money because they understood all the little nuisances of the different collectables and why something was special. They would connect with other fans for their own interest, so had the research and the market down. The downside is because they collected for their own interests very few would ever see the money because they couldn't bring themselves to sell anything. I laughed when one told their son that the sealed dusty boxes would be worth a down payment on a house. So make sure his spouse or other kids didnt toss them or sell them at an estate sale if he dies. Apparently that happens a lot.

To try and find a collectable that will make the most money generally is difficult if you don't have interest.
 

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That's an American site. Do you have anything for Canadian stuffs?
 

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A few of my coworkers are investing in physical and NFT sports cards. Doesn't interest me enough to do the research required to know what I'm doing in order to profitably get into it. I have a few non-mint rookie cards from my youth that maybe will be worth something for my distant decendants? 🤓
 

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If you're going for alternative asset classes, I think it makes sense to start with gold bullion or precious metals.

Gold (and other precious metals) are liquid and easy to invest in using an ETF. I think very few investors include any in their portfolios, so it's probably the first thing to add, after stocks and bonds.

The more esoteric things are much harder to invest in.
 

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If you like antiques, pictures, etc you can furnish and decorate your house with good quality stuff and it will go up in value, sometimes a lot especially over a long period of time. Buy new furniture and in 10 or 20 years it will be worth nothing.
 

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Collectible also depends on the market and interests can die off.

In my youth model trains were a collectible rage, I think because when the then in their 60's collectors were kids trains represented freedom and the world beyond the neighborhood where they grew up. Remember that was before TV.

But today the dreaming is via planes, or seeing the world via the internet, and trains are not as valuable any more.
 

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If you like antiques, pictures, etc you can furnish and decorate your house with good quality stuff and it will go up in value, sometimes a lot especially over a long period of time. Buy new furniture and in 10 or 20 years it will be worth nothing.
I was not going for the furniture appreciating when I was buying 60's era bedroom sets at auction for the house.

I just wanted furniture that left the factory whole.

Ikea and their ilk flat pack furniture wants to go back to little pieces as soon as some plastic connector breaks or the particle board gives way.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
It isn't exactly an investment to buy older furniture, but it is a very good long term purchase.

I recently bought a dining room buffet and hutch, lighted and beautifully carved. It is solid wood and heavy. I paid $200 for both pieces delivered off Kijijji.

The guy said it was his grandmothers and they had no room for it in their home as they had inherited furniture from his spouses parents, so he just wanted it to go to someone who would appreciate the vintage wood.

So as an investment for them.....probably not very good considering the price I paid. But as a purchase...his grandmother had it for decades and now we have it and it is still in mint condition.

My dad always told me......buy good solid wood furniture because you only have to buy it once. It was good advice.

To buy good wood furniture today is very expensive. A new dining buffet or set can cost many thousands of dollars brand new.

It makes me wonder why similar older furniture isn't worth more.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Plugging......a doctor in the US passed away from covid recently and left his sports card collection.

I think your analysis of "collecting for personal pleasure and not willing to sell it" applied there, and is pretty valid in general.

His collection was put to auction and is estimated to sell for $20 million or more. It is said to be one of the most valuable collections of all time.

Every time I think about selling my collection of cards...which is paltry compared to the good doctors, I then think.....so I sell and get money, but I won't have the cards anymore to look at. I think if we were to sell everything we own for money....we would feel like we have nothing to show from living our lives..

So I put the stuff all back and leave it for another time.

Over the years, the Tampa doctor collected sports memorabilia, mainly baseball cards, and even traveled to attend conventions to find pristine items to add to his growing collection. Nancy said he would jokingly call the cards his "paper babies."

 

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It isn't exactly an investment to buy older furniture, but it is a very good long term purchase.

My dad always told me......buy good solid wood furniture because you only have to buy it once. It was good advice.

To buy good wood furniture today is very expensive. A new dining buffet or set can cost many thousands of dollars brand new.

It makes me wonder why similar older furniture isn't worth more.
Well if you want a nice modern style, you have to buy new, which is expensive.
Or you can buy cheap stuff from Walmart and replace it every 10+ years.

That's the trend now, people want to refresh and redesign, or move every 10 years, why hold onto old furniture that doesn't fit the space or the style.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
That is exactly the opinion of our son and his partner.

Some day all this will be yours.......I said to him. Cripes he said, I will have to hire someone to cart it all away.

As far as I know, selling personal possessions for more than you paid for them is not taxable.

I think that is why many wealthy people collect "something" they consider valuable.

You have to be wealthy to play in the upper echelons of the collectibles game, to buy the most coveted stuff.
 

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That is exactly the opinion of our son and his partner.

Some day all this will be yours.......I said to him. Cripes he said, I will have to hire someone to cart it all away.

As far as I know, selling personal possessions for more than you paid for them is not taxable.
Yes, but there are limits and exceptions.
If you sell a car, you pay tax
If you sell a lot of personal stuff you have to pay.
 

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... As far as I know, selling personal possessions for more than you paid for them is not taxable.
My understanding is that personal property sales are capital gains taxable where one may have a capital gain or loss, when the ACB and the proceeds of disposition are both over one thousand dollars.



... I think that is why many wealthy people collect "something" they consider valuable.
If someone buys for $100K and sells for $200K they have a $100K capital gain to report and pay tax on. Or if one buys for $1500 and sells for $1700 a car then there is a capital gain to report.


For those that are collecting for value (be they be wealthy or not), the reasons I have read are to diversify, portability and liquidity. I'm sure there are others.

For example, buying rare stamps can be lucrative, where this article says it has rivaled gold - if one knows what they are doing. Stamps As Investments – A Bifurcated Market

Antiques and coins are other places of investment.


Cheers

PS
Which reminds me that I need to amend my 2019 tax return to add the capital loss from selling. :)
 

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It isn't exactly an investment to buy older furniture, but it is a very good long term purchase.

I recently bought a dining room buffet and hutch, lighted and beautifully carved. It is solid wood and heavy. I paid $200 for both pieces delivered off Kijijji.

The guy said it was his grandmothers and they had no room for it in their home as they had inherited furniture from his spouses parents, so he just wanted it to go to someone who would appreciate the vintage wood.

So as an investment for them.....probably not very good considering the price I paid. But as a purchase...his grandmother had it for decades and now we have it and it is still in mint condition.

My dad always told me......buy good solid wood furniture because you only have to buy it once. It was good advice.

To buy good wood furniture today is very expensive. A new dining buffet or set can cost many thousands of dollars brand new.

It makes me wonder why similar older furniture isn't worth more.
My parents had a very solid dinning room set made of all oak. It is in pristine condition even now because it was always covered with two protectors, and multiple table clothes. Yet, it's not worth very much to sell. Same with my brother when then renovated, they could barely give it away. The styles are outdating, and fewer newer homes have formal dinning rooms.

Both our parents have some perfect old furniture that is now considered retro. When we renovate we may take some, but most of their stuff is usually donated This is really the case with consumables. You buy something that you will get person enjoyment from, but don't expect others to pay for the that same enjoyment. My mother has china, furs, and a whole bunch of things that they spent a fortune on, now it's worthless and just taking room as my mom is in a home.

I stick by not getting into consumables for an investment unless it brings you personal pleasure. The exception is exotic cars.
 

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Plugging......a doctor in the US passed away from covid recently and left his sports card collection.

I think your analysis of "collecting for personal pleasure and not willing to sell it" applied there, and is pretty valid in general.

His collection was put to auction and is estimated to sell for $20 million or more. It is said to be one of the most valuable collections of all time.

Every time I think about selling my collection of cards...which is paltry compared to the good doctors, I then think.....so I sell and get money, but I won't have the cards anymore to look at. I think if we were to sell everything we own for money....we would feel like we have nothing to show from living our lives..

So I put the stuff all back and leave it for another time.

Over the years, the Tampa doctor collected sports memorabilia, mainly baseball cards, and even traveled to attend conventions to find pristine items to add to his growing collection. Nancy said he would jokingly call the cards his "paper babies."

If you are still looking at it, and get joy out of it, then keep it. Take it out when the kids and grandkids are there, and share the stories with them. That's what makes things so much more enjoyable and that's what passes on. My dad and mom has said the same thing with their 'collectables'. They wanted to pass something on to the kids. Most of it is useless, and our kids see no value, but some of it we keep because there is a story about their grandparents behind it. The irony is much of their 'collection' was gold coins/which they made into jewelry (which made it worth less because it's no longer pure), $1000 bills which are no longer legal tender, fur coats that have not be kept properly and real estate which none of us can bare to sell because it's a reminder of their hardships immigrating here with nothing. My parents gave me some of it 'in case' there were hard times and I would never be left without something of value. We have surpassed my parents in wealth, so we pass on the items to our kids but most importantly why they are so important.

So maybe get some enjoyment by passing it onto your family.
 

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My understanding is that personal property sales are capital gains taxable where one may have a capital gain or loss, when the ACB and the proceeds of disposition are both over one thousand dollars.



If someone buys for $100K and sells for $200K they have a $100K capital gain to report and pay tax on. Or if one buys for $1500 and sells for $1700 a car then there is a capital gain to report.


For those that are collecting for value (be they be wealthy or not), the reasons I have read are to diversify, portability and liquidity. I'm sure there are others.

For example, buying rare stamps can be lucrative, where this article says it has rivaled gold - if one knows what they are doing. Stamps As Investments – A Bifurcated Market

Antiques and coins are other places of investment.


Cheers

PS
Which reminds me that I need to amend my 2019 tax return to add the capital loss from selling. :)
I know a couple of people that buy Ferraris and some other rare vehicles. In one case the person has had to pay capital gains as they are in the industry and find out about these 'good' deals because of their occupation. They are keeping them for a few weeks maybe months at a time, and then sell. They have only bought a sold 3 or 4 over the years, and after the first one, have had to pay capital gains on the subsequent sales. In the other case, the person just has a lot of money and buys Ferraris for their own personal use, and sells them when they get bored of them, or it's not quite what they wanted. They have also made 3 or 4 sales of their Ferraris, but has not had to ever pay capital gains on them. Both have their accountant (same accountant) go to CRA to try and make so they didn't have capital gains, but only one successful.

I think CRA does look at the overall intent of the purchases and sales.
 

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