[jlunfirst]

AI is dependant on Telecom, which is dependant on electricity, so I don't think it's going to have a bigger impact. But I think the introduction and rollout of AI will be much bigger than the initial rollouts of any previous technology, with the possible exception of agriculture, and larger scale communities.

I think that AI is going to massively disrupt the information economy, I don't know what the next "age" is going to be, but I think we're going to see a massive restructuring of society, like the industrial revolution.
I also think that right now we have no idea what it will look like.

The politics will get very interesting, as we have very little consensus and are losing our ability to discuss issues, political factions disagree on basic facts.
Throw in Foreign/AI assisted influence and we're in for a wild ride.

Before AI gets big and deep into our economy, etc., it does feel like right now, we are at peak ideal use of computer technolgy --use technology in ways, bad or good but still take human intervention where needed AND understanding if a jerk bot is scamming us or something automatic goes wrong, we can figure out it wasn't us misremembering or not knowing.

I'm glad I won't be around, when the AI layer falls like a pall over our lives and it will become tough to distinguish: was it a real person or imperfect bot doing this.

 

[MrMatt]

I'm glad I won't be around, when the AI layer falls like a pall over our lives and it will become tough to distinguish: was it a real person or imperfect bot doing this.

Already there. Some creators are quite open about using AI extensively in their work.

FYI in grade school they're teaching and screening for AI written essays etc.

 

[jlunfirst]

Already there. Some creators are quite open about using AI extensively in their work.

FYI in grade school they're teaching and screening for AI written essays etc.

Joyful... you mean the teachers have to screen their students' essays to catch any kid using AI? I find this so sad and adds another work burden, when already the teachers are seriously challenged ..ie. behavioural problems, etc. There's nothing celebrate about this type of necessary adult vigilance and of course, kids will not appreciate it that we are trying to help them with skills development.

 

[MrMatt]

Joyful... you mean the teachers have to screen their students' essays to catch any kid using AI? I find this so sad and adds another work burden, when already the teachers are seriously challenged ..ie. behavioural problems, etc. There's nothing celebrate about this type of necessary adult vigilance and of course, kids will not appreciate it that we are trying to help them with skills development.

They've been screening for plagiarism for years.

 

[m3s]

Joyful... you mean the teachers have to screen their students' essays to catch any kid using AI? I find this so sad and adds another work burden, when already the teachers are seriously challenged ..ie. behavioural problems, etc. There's nothing celebrate about this type of necessary adult vigilance and of course, kids will not appreciate it that we are trying to help them with skills development.

If only there was a tool that could screen for that.

Some teachers realized they could use GPT to grade essays long before this news about students using it hit mainstream media. I could tell teachers weren't really reading all the essays in the first place. They always ran it through a program to confirm there was no plagiarism and then read the first, last and a few random pages.

Do you think spell checker is good or bad?

 

[jlunfirst]

They've been screening for plagiarism for years.

And will get harder for teachers to spot it. I find this all sad... we so many tools and downgrading of literacy on a slow roll for some (not all) folks.

They always ran it through a program to confirm there was no plagiarism and then read the first, last and a few random pages.

Do you think spell checker is good or bad?

Spell check is better for adults who already should know how to spell fine but aren't perfect.

Honest opinion: for young children learning to read and write, no I don't think so. It is equivalent a child not knowing how to add,subtract, multiply and divide without a caculator. Same rationale.

Gaining written literacy comes from: word recognition, how to write coherently and with good punctuation.

 

[m3s]

Gaining written literacy comes from: word recognition, how to write coherently and with good punctuation.

I agree it's a crutch, like many things. But I doubt you'll turn off your spellchecker, throw out your calculator, or your smart phone/pc

Corporate world is using chat apps now. Asia was ahead I think with WeChat. Writing out an email has so many unnecessary words.

Like that guy who writes cheers at the end of every post Imagine writing good day I hope this finds you well for every post.

 

[jlunfirst]

I agree it's a crutch, like many things. But I doubt you'll turn off your spellchecker, throw out your calculator, or your smart phone/pc

Corporate world is using chat apps now. Asia was ahead I think with WeChat. Writing out an email has so many unnecessary words.

Like that guy who writes cheers at the end of every post Imagine writing good day I hope this finds you well for every post.

I'm thinking of children and their learning, development, m3s. Not us adults.

Just last wk., a 40's woman, told me how a young sales clerk around 18yrs. old refused to give her .15 cents change or to make it from a currency bill. She kept refusing to do it. Finally the supervisor was called over and explained to the girl how to do it.

How pathetic. This is what I mean pathetic numeric literacy. AND the hand caculator was right beside the cash machine. This is survival skill when our systems break down. And they do.

 

[m3s]

How pathetic. This is what I mean pathetic numeric literacy. AND the hand caculator was right beside the cash machine. This is survival skill when our systems break down. And they do.

There's always dumb people. Always has been always will be.

I learned math even though the calculator existed. Kids can learn to write even if chatGPT exists.

Neither the calculator or chatGPT or a PC make anyone smart or dumb. It's just a tool imo

 

[jlunfirst]

There's always dumb people. Always has been always will be.

I learned math even though the calculator existed. Kids can learn to write even if chatGPT exists.

Neither the calculator or chatGPT or a PC make anyone smart or dumb. It's just a tool imo

I see this strange illiteracy when I see clerks trying to make change often enough.

I used to be retail store clerk for over 5 yrs. and I'm not mathematically inclined compared to siblings who did STEM degrees. I knew to keep my job, I had to learn how to make and count back change for customer smoothly.

 

[MrMatt]

And will get harder for teachers to spot it. I find this all sad... we so many tools and downgrading of literacy on a slow roll for some (not all) folks.

Spell check is better for adults who already should know how to spell fine but aren't perfect.

Honest opinion: for young children learning to read and write, no I don't think so. It is equivalent a child not knowing how to add,subtract, multiply and divide without a caculator. Same rationale.

Gaining written literacy comes from: word recognition, how to write coherently and with good punctuation.

Go on social media, most people are functionally illiterate as it is.

I actually had to explain to intelligent and capable staff how to write emails as I literally didn't know what they were trying to communicate.
That was years ago, and I haven't had to deal with new grads in a while, but I don't assume it's getting better.

The calculator debate is interesting, I didn't get one until we started doing trig, now they get one a few units past learning the concepts. I can say kids today are learning some math concepts years earlier than they did in the past.
Sure they might not be great at multiplying multi digit numbers in their head, or adding larger numbers, but they are learning the more significant patterns and insights.

Should we focus on spelling and basic grammatical construction? if they're able to put out some thoughts and have the computer do that "low level" work?

 

[jlunfirst]

Generative AI like ChatGPT reveal deep-seated systemic issues beyond the tech industry (theconversation.com)

 

[TomB16]

I see this strange illiteracy when I see clerks trying to make change often enough.

I used to be retail store clerk for over 5 yrs. and I'm not mathematically inclined compared to siblings who did STEM degrees. I knew to keep my job, I had to learn how to make and count back change for customer smoothly.

Math is a huge problem for a surprising number of people.

Personally, I love math. It's people that are a huge problem for me.

 

[Beaver101]

I'm thinking of children and their learning, development, m3s. Not us adults.

Just last wk., a 40's woman, told me how a young sales clerk around 18yrs. old refused to give her .15 cents change or to make it from a currency bill. She kept refusing to do it. Finally the supervisor was called over and explained to the girl how to do it.

How pathetic. This is what I mean pathetic numeric literacy. AND the hand caculator was right beside the cash machine. This is survival skill when our systems break down. And they do.

... I'm willing to bet $100 your mom who had waaay less education than that young sales clerk would know how to give back 1. the proper amount of change, and 2. not stand there like an idiot trying to weasel out of providing change.

You have to remind her that not everyone taps with their cc and that the dollar bill/loonies have been phased out in this country. And also not everyone has a smartyphone to refer to as their wallet or their need for a calculator. Sheesh.

Unbelieveable - in year 2023 that there're still people who do NOT know how to do grade 3 math.

But then there are those cashiers (you reminded me) who says "but the register (machine) is "always" correct." My response is "yeah, right, the register is "always" correct but not the person who programmed it."

 

[jlunfirst]

... I'm willing to bet $100 your mom who had waaay less education than that young sales clerk would know how to give back 1. the proper amount of change, and 2. not stand there like an idiot trying to weasel out of providing change.

............................................................................................- in year 2023 that there're still people who do NOT know how to do grade 3 math.

But then there are those cashiers (you reminded me) who says "but the register (machine) is "always" correct." My response is "yeah, right, the register is "always" correct but not the person who programmed it."

Mother is naturally mathematically inclined. We didn't appreciate this until....25-30yrs. later. All we saw was a mom who couldn't speak English but could sew and tailor whole suits with precision. She also drafted from scratch, pattern to tight design fitted 3 cushion sofa upholstry cover, for living room furniture set. It wasn't a throw blanket design. Every piece was drafted cut to fit the curves of the sofa 3 seater and matching armchair.

She and Dad used to have relaxed very long discussions in Chinese about buying stuff, planning,anything. And it was my mother doing the calcuations in her head, while my father waited for her, to spit out the numbers. It is my father with more artistic inclinations where I probably inherited that natural tendency myself.

 

[MrMatt]

Math is a huge problem for a surprising number of people.

Personally, I love math. It's people that are a huge problem for me.

Lots of people confuse arithmetic for math

 

[Beaver101]

Arithmetic is grade 3 math.

Grade 12 math is mathematics.

University level math is abstract mathematics like linear algebra (one e.g.).

 

[TomB16]

Lots of people confuse arithmetic for math

Sure but do your best.

 

[Beaver101]

Sure but do your best.

... unfortunately, some folks these days can't even do that without their calculator - handheld version replaced by their smartyphone these days.

Notice (almost) no one carries a pen/pencil and a piece of paper with them these days as 90% of the population carries a cellphone, preferably a smart one instead.