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Canada senior stimulus because of coronavirus

10K views 67 replies 22 participants last post by  Longtimeago 
#1 ·
Hello,

Does somebody have information regarding Canada senior stimulus because of coronavirus?

Thank you!

Selena
 
#3 ·
And that is the right way to address the issue for seniors whose 2020 withdrawal, if not yet done at the start of the year, will take a bigger chunk of the nest egg. Of course, no one has to spend the withdrawal amount, though that is what seems to be the concept stuck in many minds.

Other than being in higher risk groups for a fatal experience with COVID-19, there really is nothing else in the current crisis that should create a hardship for seniors.
 
#10 ·
But, as you know, there's a minimum mandatory yearly withdrawal. I would say that the only ones not getting anything are those that withdraw more than the mandatory minimum.
I dont see that reducing the rrif required min withdrawal helps anyone except those who dont need to withdraw. They may reduce their taxable income by withdrawing less.

Others may still withdraw the same amount in $$, because that is what they need to live off. So no help to them.

We have already made our withdrawal. Maybe we could move some of that back? They allowed that previous time min was reduced.
 
#12 ·
I heard the tail end of a comment on the news yesterday about 'what happens to retirees who are seeing their savings invested in stocks tank right now.' Something like that.

It made me shake my head. First, their savings are not tanking, only the 'paper' value is tanking. Second, when they chose to GAMBLE on the stock market, they made their choice. I do not see any reason why anyone should expect the government to aid them in such a case. If they don't sell, they have no loss, only a diminished value on the market. Again, their choice to make.

I don't see how anything about Covid-19 that doesn't apply to how it will affect all ages should be different for retirees. As a retiree, I see NO affect on me financially at all. Perhaps some prices of goods and services will become higher as a result, just as the price of gasoline is currently lower as a result but I see no major implications to me financially. But then, I am not sitting here saying, 'oh my savings that I GAMBLED on the stock market are tanking. What if I go broke.'
 
#13 · (Edited)
That's one way of looking at it LTA.

I agree that the stock market is a gamble, put in its best light. But very few of us think that way. The word drilled into people, particularly since the days when the older crowd could park their life savings in GICs, CSBs and such interest-bearing things, with returns at 10-20% p.a., is that one must get into "equities". Or gold. Or something. Don't just sit there dammit, is what we have been told.

I have eschewed both the stock market and gold. Well, not quite. Back in the 80s I got suckered into putting some money into mutual funds as an RRSP "investment". It was a popular thing to do once upon a time. I chipped in for a few years then got cold feet. I think perhaps in light of the market meltdown that occurred circa 1987 or so (which was probably a mere piffle compared to what's happening in the market now). I put in maybe a total of $20,000 or so and forgot about it. The last time I saw a statement my "market value" was reported at something like $140,000. No, I have not bothered to look lately. Probably now worth half of that or less and still vanishing. Not material to my retirement (unless all else fails, as it might).

So it's that "unless all else fails" that I would like you to address. You retired around age 40 and I am guessing you do not have something like an indexed civil service pension paying $75,000 or so a year. But you are faring well and seem unconcerned. So in what are you "invested"? Or are you? Is it that you simply have a warehouse full of cash that will not be exhausted in your lifetime come what may?

In my case, I have an indexed pension that will not likely go bankrupt, but it only pays about $38,000 a year, so not enuff to live on. I'll soon be able to add to that the current max CPP of $1,000 a month or whatever current max is. A bit of help. I'll be told I am too rich for OAS, not that anyone with an income under about $250,000 a year is anywhere close to rich. I have rental real estate in Los Angeles that pays in US dollars. But, if the world goes to hell in a handbasket, as it well might, that might well crap out on me. There are dire reports out of California. The tenants will be allowed to discontinue paying rent, they will be protected by law from eviction and I'll be paying their way for as long as I can afford to subsidize them. It will be me that pays the $1,000 US a month property tax on the place, and a few other bills, not them. And, thanks to Proposition 13, I am lucky after owning the place for about 25 years that the tax is at that low level. But Prop 13 might disappear in the new order.

I have forest lands in my portfolio and a goodly number of cubic meters of mostly Douglas fir and western red cedar I can harvest, but will it be worth anything in the times ahead? I have no idea.

In brief compass, what i am saying is that I "gambled" on the stock market with my mutual RRSP funds. That has proven to be a loser. I accept I gambled and lost. Mind you, if the taxpayers want to bail me out, well.... Then I "gambled" in real estate. Plainly a gamble by any yardstick. The outcome there remains at large. Then I "gambled" with forest lands. Again, I knew all along that timber prices were not guaranteed to climb forever. What might lead to a loss of value was never sure, but one could guess. Maybe, for eg. Doug fir would no longer be used for framing houses. It would be aluminum or something else. Maybe some disease would kill the trees. Or climate change would usher in their demise. Now, maybe COVID-19 will kill off a large part of the world population and no new construction of any kind will be needed for a long, long, time. There will be vacant houses everywhere and selling or renting real estate will provide no income.

LTA, in you post you profess to be immune to any financial difficulty come hell or high water and I would really like to know, if you care to share, how you are able to pull that off. I am mostly in the gambling camp, as revealed above, and might get walloped. Even my government pensions might not be so secure. If government moves to hand out money hand over fist (as would appear to be the current tack), how long can governments maintain payments to pensioners? Perhaps the only hope is for COVID-19 to kill all the pensioners.
 
#26 · (Edited)
That's one way of looking at it LTA.



LTA, in you post you profess to be immune to any financial difficulty come hell or high water and I would really like to know, if you care to share, how you are able to pull that off. I am mostly in the gambling camp, as revealed above, and might get walloped. Even my government pensions might not be so secure. If government moves to hand out money hand over fist (as would appear to be the current tack), how long can governments maintain payments to pensioners? Perhaps the only hope is for COVID-19 to kill all the pensioners.
I have started writing a response to you several times Mukhang pera and deleted what I wrote each time. I can't find an easy way to answer your question without having to go into too many specifics and too much detail.

The basics are that you must earn more than you spend. By that I mean using something like the Rule of 3s which I try to follow in regards to income. That says, you spend 1/3 on expenses, 1/3 on discretionary spending and leave 1/3 for saving/investing. Most retirees come nowhere near that for various reasons including not being very good at managing their expenses and spending too much on discretionary spending. It requires an entire paradigm shift from how money is handled while still working to how it is handled when retired.

For example, someone who comes home from a long day of work may be too tired to cook and either order-in food or go out to a restaurant. In retirement, some people expect to continue doing that to the same degree even though they no longer have the same need to do so. It's a simple example of continuing habits that were applicable to another lifestyle. This same continuing of habits applies to all kinds of things to do with what people spend money on.

People get told if you earn $100k a year when working, they need to have $70k per year when retired. I say that is absolute nonsense. You reveal you have an indexed pension of $38k and then note, 'not enuff to live on'. I say poppycock. You can easily live on that amount if you choose to. It won't be enough to follow the Rule of 3s I outlined but it will certainly be enough to live on if you have no debt when you retire.

Something like 25% of Canadians go into retirement still owing on a mortgage or paying rent. The two biggest expenses anyone has are food and shelter. There are ways to spend less on food some as simple as reducing order-in food or going out to restaurants so often that I mentioned above. Others are simply about learning to be a smarter food shopper. No one in my opinion should be going into retirement without a home bought and paid for. No rent, no mortgage. Eliminate that and you reduce your income requirement significantly.

People struggle with the question of 'how much is enough' in terms of capital and/or income. They struggle because they always come at it from one perspective. First they start listing their expenditures and then they look to see how to generate that much income and how much capital they will need to generate it. Then they discover they will need a LOT of capital to actually generate that much income UNLESS they start drawing down their capital (savings). They then become the people who when times are bad, have a problem. They can see their savings suddenly being worth less on paper because they are in stocks and that since the MUST withdraw to eat, their savings are going to have to actually diminish in real terms because they must withdraw and turn the paper loss into a real loss.

But it is possible to approach the whole thing from a different perspective. Shift the paradigm. Instead of starting from what are my expenses and how much income do I therefore need to generate, it is entirely possible to change the start to, 'how much income can I generate and how much therefore MUST my expenses be limited to.'

When you approach it from that perspective it changes all kinds of things in your thinking. Spending does NOT dictate income, income dictates spending. Let's suppose I only have 38k annual income. I have a home bought and paid for, I can't retire without that, it's a rule I have set for myself based on how I intend to manage my retirement. My income will not ALLOW me to do otherwise. Income dictates spending. I can't afford a mortgage or rent, that's non-negotiable.

So I have my home and $38k. Now I decide I am going to use the Rule of 3s (you can other rules if you want, here is a popular one: https://www.thebalance.com/the-50-30-20-rule-of-thumb-453922)

So I take my $38k and divide by 3 which then tells me I MUST maintain my expenses around $12,600 per year. That's all my fixed expenses including groceries(biggest fixed expense). If that means I cannot afford the 'all bells and whistles' TV package or fasting in the world internet package, so be it. If I must learn to shop for groceries wisely enough to manage it on $400 per month, so be it. Income dictates spending. So I learn to be frugal.

But I'm not suffering. I also have $12,600 of discretionary spending. So I can go out to a restaurant if I want or buy a new shirt just because I happen to really like that one I see in the store. I also have $12,600 that I can save each year and it along with my discretionary funds mean that if I have some unexpected real expense come along like needing a new furnace in the house, I have the money to pay for that without having to worry about it.

Obviously, the more income I have, the more of each category I have but there is almost NO reasonable number that is so low that I cannot still enjoy life. There are plenty of retirees who would be more than happy to have an income of $38k per year and that brings us to perhaps the biggest paradigm shift of all for our society. Money does NOT buy happiness. Studies have shown repeatedly more wealth simply create more wants, not more happiness.

When people think they need more money than they have, it is to feed wants and what they should really be asking themselves, 'why am I not happy with what I have and how can I be happy with what I have. What's missing, it isn't money once I have enough to meet my actual needs.'

Someone who has some index linked pension income, perhaps some GIC's that they take the income from and portion in thirds in the same way, a home they own and who learn to live on the income they have, has no need to worry themselves with the stock market or drawing down savings, etc. The object of the game is in the end to learn to live a happy life and that is not dependent on money.

https://www.livescience.com/10881-global-study-money-buy-happiness.html
 
#24 ·
The assumption that "seniors" are all sitting at home collecting pensions is a false one. Many seniors are still working because they have to or want to.

They pay into the EI program so they are entitled to the same benefits as everyone else.

There is no major financial relief for seniors, just because they are seniors.
 
#25 ·
I know many seniors who have no savings ,RRSP and only pensions are CPP ,OAS.My old cleaning lady is 72 and rents drives a 7 year old car and has maybe $10,000 which is really her burial money.This forum is not a true representation of most seniors and their situations.Having said that her financial situation is the same today as it was 6 months ago and her income/expenses will not change much.People who struggled before will likely struggle more due to job loss and we will really see how close people are to going bankrupt in coming weeks and months.I see so many posts online of people saying they cannot pay April rent or bills which is unbelievable to me given these shuts downs only occurred a week ago.
 
#27 ·
Thanks for that response LTA.

When I say I cannot live on $38k/yr., of course I can if that's all there is. I am sure I could cut that in half and still survive. But, I have carved out a certain lifestyle that demands more and, so long as the income is there, I'll carry on as always.

But the one thing you have not even hinted at, is your income sources. And I'll not press on that. Maybe not something you care to touch upon. But, whatever they may be, you seem to be quite confident that they are bulletproof. I do not think too many have such sources. Sure, I expect some here on CMF to have such. Some here are at Level 7 (I think that's the number I saw on FWF) - "Financial Abundance". That probably starts somewhere around $15 -20 million or so. Those with such resources are probably able to weather just about any storm.

For me, as I have said, almost all of my income sources are tied to some sort of gamble. To a lesser extent are my government pensions, but given how things are unfolding today, I would not regard their security as immutable. Also as I said, I expect the bit I have in RRSP mutual funds to be essentially rendered worthless in the past week or so and unlikely to return to any real value in my lifetime. Further, I am not too far off having to RRIF those funds, so I'll have to start to draw down what little might remain, unable to allow the value to rebuild. But I never regarded my RRSP as part of my retirement strategy. I gave up on it years ago and just left what I had there to sit there, largely unnoticed.

No one here on CMF seems to be expressing any angst about markets of late and that is probably because they are lifelong students of these things and got out at the peak and will soon be happily scooping up bargains. Either that, or they hold dividend stocks. From what I glean here, dividend stocks are about as bulletproof an investment as one can get. Even if share prices take a beating, dividends only go up. Seems odd to me, but then I have never had any savvy about the market.

The only consolation I have at the moment is that I have a variety of income sources and I would not expect all to crap out at once. But that might be wishful thinking. The US rents have been a bonus of late, what with the strong US dollar, but I understand LA is now on lockdown. Stick your nose outside your door and it will be shot off, or something. So maybe my tenants will say they can't work, ergo can't pay rent and they'll be sending me thank you notes for taking care of them. I am hoping that those able to pay rents of $5,000 US or so a month have their financial houses in order and will continue to pay their bills, but, again, that might be wishful thinking. I'll know soon. At least I'll know if I make it much longer as someone over 60 in a covid-19 world. And, if I don't, I won't care, will I? Come to think of it, any concern I have is not for me, but those I leave behind.

The other thing that consoles me is that, if just about all fails, I can pull in my horns, stay where I am, and kinda' live off the land. We won't starve here and the surroundings are agreeable.
 
#30 ·
No one here on CMF seems to be expressing any angst about markets of late and that is probably because they are lifelong students of these things and got out at the peak and will soon be happily scooping up bargains. Either that, or they hold dividend stocks. From what I glean here, dividend stocks are about as bulletproof an investment as one can get. Even if share prices take a beating, dividends only go up.

the idea that dividends can only rise towards infinity is Part 1 of the story. Part 2 lags behind some distance.

part 2 says that a recession-prolonged bear market will see dividends cut. Some even eliminated.

we're not hearing any sounds about this yet but if the above scenario should play itself out, part 2 will see a wailing & a moaning the likes of which will carry all the way across the sea to your sweet little island.
 
#34 ·
Sags, do not confuse 'frugal' with 'cheap', or with 'doing without.' They are different things entirely. Frugal simply means finding the best price for something you want. In other words, trying to find the best 'value for money' that you can.

So for example, if I want to vacation in Switzerland, I will not fly economy class. Now all I have to do is find the best possible prices that meet those criteria for me and then I go ahead and do what I enjoy doing, hiking in Switzerland. I will spend more for an airplane seat because I see comfort as being worth more value for money than flying 8 hours with my knees up around my chin. But I will still look for the lowest price for that seat that I can find. That's being frugal and has nothing to do with being cheap.
 
#41 ·
I have 2 years worth of living expenses in cash right now. I know I may not be 'usual' but I hope this is a wake up call for most of the need to have liquidity and that forgoing a bit of consumption now can mean less stress in the event of an unexpected loss of income. I am resigned to having to pay for everyone else to get bailed out in this situation.
 
#43 ·
A year or so ago on this forum people were talking about a survey that found nearly half of all Canadians were only $200 away from insolvency with insolvency being defined as unable to pay their bills. Many here were saying they found it hard to believe. Well now we are seeing it happen as we read about people who do not even have enough savings to pay their rent literally TOMORROW after being laid off 2 weeks ago due to Covid-19.

Whether they will learn anything from the experience though andrewf, I tend to doubt. We are going to have to bail them out as you say and what that will teach them is what? That if they fail, someone (in this case the government) will bail them out.

Those that have never learned to take responsibility for themselves before aren't likely to learn it now. We would have to let them get just on the verge of starving to death and being thrown out on the street and even then I don't know if they would learn, they'd probably just complain more about why no one helped them sooner.
 
#44 ·
I understand what you're saying LTA ... it's all a matter of perspective.

You see investing in company stocks as a gamble and it is. I see starting your own company as a gamble and it is. I just prefer to invest in someone elses company where you may prefer to invest directly into your own ... both methods can work and both can fail.
 
#45 ·
The risk with illiquid assets like RE and video rental machine is if you need cash, it is hard to convert those assets to cash in tumultuous times. And with things like RE, you might think that the risk of any one tenant defaulting on rent is mostly independent/uncorrelated. This situation puts the lie to that as many people are not going to have the money to pay their rent this month. Banks may be less understanding when it comes to mortgages.
 
#47 ·
You are right andrewf but then, liquid or illiquid, RE, stocks and possibly even gold are gambles (and I have never owned gold, but apparently it's what everyone wants in tumultuous times, more than food or shelter). And it's in recognition of that reality most of us gamblers usually learn early on that one must never gamble what one is not prepared to lose.

So, even with the scary notion of owning a rental real estate property, one should plan for the worst case scenario when buying, which would be that its value drops to zero and the mortgage (if you incur that obligation), must still be paid, along with all the other bills. If you cannot foresee holding out indefinitely with no income from the property, while paying the expenses, then it's not a risk you should take. Same for stocks. If you think their losing the bulk of their value in a short time and many years to recover -if ever - will cause issues for you, stay out.

Whether it's starting a business, buying an "investment" or whatever, what most accountants learn in their training (at least when I was studying accounting) is the credo: "Anticipate all losses; expect no gains." Those words ring as true today as they did when I was starting out. Time has only served to enhance their meaning.
 
#48 ·
I realized a long time ago my father had the right idea on how to protect yourself from times like this .He has never had much debt and always lived within his means ,he owned one stock in his life which was Newfoundland Light and Power ,now Fortis and bought it around 1982.Other than that he always bought GICs and was lucky to have money way back when interest rates were double digits.
He and My Mom have $30,000 a year income and actually save from that income as they only pay utilities small property taxes and their food and entertainment budgets.They are 80 and 81 still have full TFSA and since my brother passed 6 years ago they have been giving their 3 grand kids $xxxx a year cash gifts .He does not expect any money from the government and does not need it.The big factor for my parents that others do not have is they have owned their home free and clear and never have paid rent.Even 40 years ago when they built a new home for $90000 it was all cash.I have a feeling in next year we may see the 50+ age group downsizing their debt and many investors will be getting out of their rentals after the tenants get to live for free most of 2020.
 
#49 ·
Q: What is an Economic Stimulus payment?
A: It is money that the federal government will send to taxpayers.

Q: Where will the government get this money?
A: From taxpayers.

Q: So the government is giving me back my own money?
A: Only a smidgen of it.

Q: What is the purpose of this payment?
A: The plan is for you to use the money to purchase a high definition television set, a new iPad, or a new SUV, thus stimulating the economy.

Q: Isn’t that stimulating the economy of China ?
A: Shut up.

Below is some helpful advice on how to best help the U. S. Economy with and your stimulus check wisely:

  • If you spend the stimulus money at Walmart the money will go to China or Sri Lanka.
  • if you spend it on gasoline, your money goes to the Arabs.
  • if you purchase a computer, it goes to India, Taiwan or China.
  • if you purchase fruits and vegetables, it will go to Mexico, Honduras, and Guatemala.
  • if you buy an efficient car, it will go to Japan or Korea.
  • if you purchase useless stuff, it goes to Taiwan.
  • if you pay your credit card off, or buy stock, it will go to the management bonuses and they will hide it offshore.

Instead keep the money in America by:
(1) Spending it at a yard sale, or
(2) Go to a ballgame, or
(3) Spend it on prostitutes, or
(4) Beer, or
(5) Tattoos
(These are the only American businesses still operating in the U.S.)

CONCLUSION: Go to a ballgame with a tattooed prostitute that you met at a yard sale and drink beer all day. No need to thank me, I’m just glad I could be of help.
 
#53 ·
#59 ·
For those interested, I just made my first new direct investment in a while. An opportunity created as a direct result of the pandemic.

I just bought some wine that was put up for sale by a prominent NYC restaurant that I presume needed some cash right now. Firesale price. It will sit in a NYC wine warehouse(minimal cost) until things get back to the 'new normal', whatever and whenever that might be. Even if it has to sit for say 2 years before I sell and even if I have to sell at the pre-Covid19 market price, I should be able to get a 40% return on the purchase price. I consider that a decent return for a 2 year investment.

I've dabbled in wine now and then and have an acquaintance who makes his living doing it 'full time' although I doubt he has ever worked 40 hours in a week in his life. Direct investments like this one or antiques, jewellery, art, postage stamps, etc. etc. are not something though that just anyone can jump into. They each require a degree of knowledge of the specific market. BUT that can be learned if someone wants to do so. Usually it appeals to someone who has a specific interest in that market. I like drinking wine.


As for the effect of the virus, read here. Talking Trade – Amid global Covid-19 uncertainty fine wine offers stability - Liv-ex

Wine does NOT follow the stock market trend and consistently outperforms the market.
 
#60 ·
So not new news but I thought I would add it to this thread. I'm surprised no one already has.

So all us seniors who qualify for OAS are going to get a $3-500 handout from the federal government. Supposedly, this is to cover extra expenses we have incurred as a result of the virus. I know some seniors have incurred some extra expenses but I wonder what percentage of us have. We certainly haven't incurred any that I can think of.

I think this handout is more of a political move than anything else. A response to those who think along the lines of, 'hey, everybody is getting a handout but me' and their potential resentment come election time. So throw them a bone.

My wife and I don't need the money and as I mentioned in another thread are thinking about some way to 'pay it forward' to people who perhaps do need it and have done something like essential work that should be rewarded given the increased risk they have been taking.

We initially thought of finding a way to buy lunch for all the employees and volunteers at our local Foodland. All the delivery and pick-up orders are being done by volunteers, not paid staff. These volunteers have been doing this for years for seniors who for whatever reason were not able to do their own shopping. Now they have simply extended that to any seniors who are self-isolating. The staff of course are all working under increased risk and so we thought to reward both groups with a lunch.

The problem I'm having is trying to figure out HOW to do it. You can't get them all together as a group obviously for a sit down lunch like say a barbecue lunch in the parking lot. I thought of having their bakery and deli section put together some kind of 'box lunches' but that doesn't sound very exciting. I also thought of finding out the number of people involved and having the store owner hand out a Timmy's card to each. But I really don't like 'gift cards', they are for when you can't think of a personal gift to give someone or don't care enough to try and think of one to give them.

So, anyone got any bright ideas of what we could do to reward these people? I always try to practice 'showing' thanks and not just saying thanks. I think showing your thanks is a whole lot more meaningful than just saying thanks.
 
#61 ·
@Longtimeago It is difficult try and be 'personal' for people you don't know especially right now. Food is usually always a good thing, but a get together of any sort is challenging.

I would like to offer an alternative suggestion of Girl Guide cookies as thank you gift. I will fully disclose that I am leader for my kids units and am actively involved with the organization. Millions of boxes of cookies were in transit for sale right when COVID hit. Girl Guides Canada stopped all activities including cookie sales. Many leaders and volunteers had to receive their cookies and they are currently sitting in people homes because we cannot sell them retail wise or do our normal door to door campaigns. I personally know of leaders that have thousands of boxes of cookies in there homes waiting. There have been some very kind stores that have been selling cookies on our behalf (Canadian Tire, Sobeys, London Drugs). Due to safety, many of these cookies were the ones that were in transit (so no touching by anyone). That still leaves units that had already received their cookies, and cannot sell them. There are tens of thousand of girls that use these programs not including the thousands of volunteer leaders. The amount of good they do in the community is staggering and what they learn in these programs are amazing. Right now, there are units that are not sure how they are going to run in the fall, they have thousands of dollars inventory, and cookies is the main source of funds for the units.

Most people are quite found of Girl Guides and their cookies. There have been many requests in my area for cookies to be dropped off (by a responsible leader) to different organizations as thank yous. So far the response has been very positive from any of the receivers. It's a win-win-win for everyone. The receivers get a nice treat, the givers get to know they are helping the community, giving something that helps locals, and it supports the girls in the community. Depending on the leaders, I know I have had special requests if I can get one of my girls to write a little card or thank you.

That's my pitch on girl guide cookies. I am sure I could help you locate a unit wherever in Canada you are. For $600, you could buy a 120 boxes (10 cases) and give each person a few, and keep some for yourself.
 
#63 ·
@Longtimeago It is difficult try and be 'personal' for people you don't know especially right now. Food is usually always a good thing, but a get together of any sort is challenging.

I would like to offer an alternative suggestion of Girl Guide cookies as thank you gift. I will fully disclose that I am leader for my kids units and am actively involved with the organization. Millions of boxes of cookies were in transit for sale right when COVID hit. Girl Guides Canada stopped all activities including cookie sales. Many leaders and volunteers had to receive their cookies and they are currently sitting in people homes because we cannot sell them retail wise or do our normal door to door campaigns. I personally know of leaders that have thousands of boxes of cookies in there homes waiting. There have been some very kind stores that have been selling cookies on our behalf (Canadian Tire, Sobeys, London Drugs). Due to safety, many of these cookies were the ones that were in transit (so no touching by anyone). That still leaves units that had already received their cookies, and cannot sell them. There are tens of thousand of girls that use these programs not including the thousands of volunteer leaders. The amount of good they do in the community is staggering and what they learn in these programs are amazing. Right now, there are units that are not sure how they are going to run in the fall, they have thousands of dollars inventory, and cookies is the main source of funds for the units.

Most people are quite found of Girl Guides and their cookies. There have been many requests in my area for cookies to be dropped off (by a responsible leader) to different organizations as thank yous. So far the response has been very positive from any of the receivers. It's a win-win-win for everyone. The receivers get a nice treat, the givers get to know they are helping the community, giving something that helps locals, and it supports the girls in the community. Depending on the leaders, I know I have had special requests if I can get one of my girls to write a little card or thank you.

That's my pitch on girl guide cookies. I am sure I could help you locate a unit wherever in Canada you are. For $600, you could buy a 120 boxes (10 cases) and give each person a few, and keep some for yourself.
No offense intended Plugging Along but I personally do not like GG Cookies and never have. While I will buy a box if a GG shows up at my door (none ever has in our present home), I just throw them in the garbage unopened.

I also don't see it as an answer in that I estimate there are probably around 35-40 potential recipients over which I am looking at distributing around $600+ The 6 from the government handout and maybe a bit more from my pocket if a particularly good idea was going to cost us a bit more than that. So that's at least $15 per person. I can't imagine them all being thankful for 3 boxes each of GG cookies.

So while I appreciate your 'pitch', I'm afraid my answer is, 'no sale'.

I should also add that I do see it as being a bit more personal in that being a small town and a small Foodland, we do 'know' most of the staff simply through repeated contact with them. Not on a first name basis but as recognizable to each other even to the point of saying hello, etc. when we pass on the street.
 
#64 ·
Well I had to look up 'virtual signalling' Zipper as that was a new term for me. I can see how you might see it as that but showing thanks rather than just saying thanks is something that my parents taught me and that I have tried to teach to my children from an early age. I have been in the habit of showing my thanks since I was a youngster. It's not something I am writing about on social media just to 'show others I am a good person'.

Nowadays, I think people are lucky if they even get a thank you card for a wedding present but that is not how I was brought up. For example when my dentist did an emergency repair for me without an appointment in advance and in her lunch hour, I felt I should not just pay my bill but also show her I appreciated her and so I had flowers delivered the next day. When my wife was in for a regular check up a few weeks later, the staff were all saying to her how surprised they were by the flowers arriving and how much the dentist appreciated being SHOWN she was appreciated.

I really do believe there is a huge difference between just saying thank you and showing your thanks.
 
#66 ·
It's going to take some thought to find something that will appeal to all I guess. When I think of your 'gift bag'' idea, it sounds good if I say it fast enough but then I think of gift baskets I have received and they always seem to contain as many items I don't like as they do items I do like.

Given our current heat wave (real feel 37C here today), the idea of good quality wicking(not cotton) t-shirts popped into my head. Maybe I could think of something witty to have printed on them to do with being Covid Heroes. But then I would need to know how many of each size to buy.

'I fight Covid-19 daily for you'.
 
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