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Gold has considerable intrinsic value. It is used globally in jewellery, electronics, dentistry, furniture and art. It is highly valued in many cultures.

Where is the intrinsic value in a bitcoin ?

The price volatility makes it useless as a currency or use in contracts.

Let's say for example a person buys a $400,000 car for 10 bitcoins that are valued at $40,000 each today.

They put a down payment down of 1 bitcoin and come back in 3 days after the dealer preps the car to pay the 9 bitcoin balance.

But let's say, the value of a bitcoin went up to $50,000 a bitcoin or down to $30,000 a bitcoin......does the buyer now pay $500,000 for a $400,000 vehicle or $310,000 for a $400,000 vehicle ?

Unless bitcoins have a stable price.........they are of no use in the business world
 

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Bitcoins are deemed "scarce" because of the 21 million coins mined cap.

What if the huge mining farms decide they don't want to stop mining bitcoins if they are worth say..........$100,000 each ?

The theory is that the decentralized individual miners won't support it, but I suspect the rise in difficulty will blow them out long before the last coins are mined.

The mining farms will be the only ones mining the last coins, and they may decide to add another 10 million coins and take over all transaction verification.

There is no regulation to stop them from doing so.
 

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Bitcoins are deemed "scarce" because of the 21 million coins mined cap.

What if the huge mining farms decide they don't want to stop mining bitcoins if they are worth say..........$100,000 each ?

The theory is that the decentralized individual miners won't support it, but I suspect the rise in difficulty will blow them out long before the last coins are mined.

The mining farms will be the only ones mining the last coins, and they may decide to add another 10 million coins and take over all transaction verification.

There is no regulation to stop them from doing so.
We'll see in 120 years. at which point the state of technology will be very different, just as it was 120 years ago.

No regulation from stopping them, however if they decide to change the protocol, all that will happen is bitcoin will split, as it has many times already
We will have Bitcoin-Classic and Bitcoin-Mo-Mining, and people can evaluate them however they want.
 

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We'll see in 120 years. at which point the state of technology will be very different, just as it was 120 years ago.

No regulation from stopping them, however if they decide to change the protocol, all that will happen is bitcoin will split, as it has many times already
We will have Bitcoin-Classic and Bitcoin-Mo-Mining, and people can evaluate them however they want.
Exactly. Miners can decide to break the consensus rules, but the rest of the network will simply reject those blocks as invalid. Why would the rest of the network support the "Mo-Mining" coin, which is no longer limited in supply? In fact, I can't even see miners supporting it for very long because it's guaranteed to lose value as it's less scare than "Bitcoin-Classic". Don't forget that miners also make money from transaction fees, which will be mainly on the Bitcoin-Classic chain. The Mo-Mining coin might attract a small following, but it would suffer from diminishing value and lack of transactions, just as happened to Bitcoin Cash a few years ago.
 

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Exactly. Miners can decide to break the consensus rules, but the rest of the network will simply reject those blocks as invalid. Why would the rest of the network support the "Mo-Mining" coin, which is no longer limited in supply? In fact, I can't even see miners supporting it for very long because it's guaranteed to lose value as it's less scare than "Bitcoin-Classic". Don't forget that miners also make money from transaction fees, which will be mainly on the Bitcoin-Classic chain. The Mo-Mining coin might attract a small following, but it would suffer from diminishing value and lack of transactions, just as happened to Bitcoin Cash a few years ago.
However the converse is true, if it was seen as a GOOD IDEA, it will take on the value.
ETC vs ETH
 

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Reading about a guy who has 7,000 bitcoins (worth $250 million today) locked up in some kind of hardware wallet that he has been unable to access for years (it won't recognize his password and he only has 2 tries left out of 10) jarred my memory that I did have an old computer hooked up with a mining program way back when.

I can't even remember the website involved (group mining company I think) and have no idea if I had earned any bitcoins. I eventually got bored because the bitcoins weren't worth much and my computer was continually churning away, so I stopped the program and likely deleted it.

The computer is still in the basement but it became unstable and I replaced it. I would need to hook up a monitor (I have an all in one desktop now) and check it out.

My question is........what would I look for in the files if I can access the hard drive in it ? Does bitcoin reward save to a file or something ?

I doubt I would be so lucky, but my curiosity is piqued now.

Can I hook the old computer (with no monitor) up to the all in one computer so I can see the contents ?
 

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Hmmm...........maybe it was this mining pool as it was around that time......https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Slush_Pool

It says that distributions were "sent out" when it reached a pre-set value. What does that mean........an email or cheque in the mail ?
 

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Hmmm...........maybe it was this mining pool as it was around that time......https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Slush_Pool

It says that distributions were "sent out" when it reached a pre-set value. What does that mean........an email or cheque in the mail ?
I also used Slush Pool for a while. You would have had a wallet address, to which the rewards were sent once they reached a threshold. It was every .01 BTC as I recall, back when I was into mining. Hopefully you had the wallet on your computer... search for a file called wallet.dat.

Also check your email to find records of where the payments were sent.

21126
 

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Can I hook the old computer (with no monitor) up to the all in one computer so I can see the contents ?
If you can't turn on the computer you will need to remove the hard drive and connect it to your working computer. You can mount the hard drive inside the case if you have room (and the required cables) or you can use an external hard drive enclosure to connect it via USB.
 

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Discussion Starter #91
Reading about a guy who has 7,000 bitcoins (worth $250 million today) locked up in some kind of hardware wallet that he has been unable to access for years (it won't recognize his password and he only has 2 tries left out of 10)
He has lost the $250 million. It's gone.

I can't even remember the website involved (group mining company I think) and have no idea if I had earned any bitcoins. I eventually got bored because the bitcoins weren't worth much and my computer was continually churning away, so I stopped the program and likely deleted it.

The computer is still in the basement but it became unstable and I replaced it. I would need to hook up a monitor (I have an all in one desktop now) and check it out.

My question is........what would I look for in the files if I can access the hard drive in it ? Does bitcoin reward save to a file or something ?
This is definitely worth looking into.

There is no easy answer to the questions you're asking. You're going to have to check your wallet and see if there are any BTC in it.
 

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Sounds like SHOP is about to have a legal battle. The damage has already been done to Ledger's reputation

Security Notice Dear client,

On December 23, 2020, Shopify, our e-commerce service provider, informed Ledger of an incident involving merchant data. Rogue agent(s) of their customer support team obtained Ledger customer transactional records in April and June 2020. This is related to the incident reported by Shopify in September 2020, which concerns more than 200 merchants, but until December 21, 2020, Shopify had not identified this affected Ledger as well.

We were able to examine the stolen data together with a third party forensic firm to identify the impacted customers.

We regret to inform you that you are part of the customers whose detailed personal information was stolen by Shopify rogue agent(s). Specifically, your name and surname, detail of product(s) ordered, phone number and your postal address were exposed.

We notified the French Data Protection Authority on December 26, 2020. We are continuing to work with Shopify and law enforcement on the case; an investigation is already underway, led by the FBI and the RCMP. Ledger also reported the events to the French Public Prosecutor and filed a complaint against the rogue agent(s).

Thefts and attacks such as this cannot go uninvestigated or unprosecuted. We continue to work with law enforcement as well as private investigators on these cases, and we are adding more firepower by hiring additional private investigation capacity, adding experience and approaches to finding those responsible for these data thefts.

FINALLY, keeping you secure is our reason for existing. We will soon release a technical solution that will remove the 24 words as the single pillar of the security of our hardware wallets and will open the door to funds insurance.

If you would like more detail on the many steps we are taking to prevent such incidents in the future, please read this blog post.

Sincerely, Pascal Gauthier Ledger CEO
There's a lot of very angry Ledger customers who had their names/address/email leaked. This is why a PO Box and burner email is a good idea.
 

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My question is........what would I look for in the files if I can access the hard drive in it ? Does bitcoin reward save to a file or something ?
Your balance is recorded to an address on the blockchain. Every blockchain node records and verifies all the transactions.

Your old computer is worthless without a seed phrase to access the wallet. You can restore/control your wallet from any other computer.
 

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Your balance is recorded to an address on the blockchain. Every blockchain node records and verifies all the transactions.

Your old computer is worthless without a seed phrase to access the wallet. You can restore/control your wallet from any other computer.
He may not even need a seed phrase... the wallet.dat file may be completely unencrypted, which was fairly common in those days. If there is no wallet.dat, he may have saved the private key to a plain text file. A lot of people didn't bother with encryption in those early days, because anything less than a few hundred Bitcoins wasn't worth a great deal.
 

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I will give it a go for an unencrypted data file wallet, but I don't have any password to open one.

Maybe I am setting myself up for a disappointment or a worse disappointment. First nothing is there and worse........something is there but I can't open it.
 
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