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Give me which ever you want. We’ll know which One is best and how to dose it in 6 months. Then we can all go and get the preferred version. I’d guess we’re getting boosters next year, especially if more dangerous variants keep occurring.
 

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Give me which ever you want. We’ll know which One is best and how to dose it in 6 months. Then we can all go and get the preferred version. I’d guess we’re getting boosters next year, especially if more dangerous variants keep occurring.
Based on current data Moderna is number 1 and no one is lining up for JNJ or Astrazenca. The data shows that the Moderna protection lasts longer then Pfizer. I suspect they have a larger sized dose.
 

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Based on current data Moderna is number 1 and no one is lining up for JNJ or Astrazenca. The data shows that the Moderna protection lasts longer then Pfizer. I suspect they have a larger sized dose.
Agreed. Kind of highlights the only real problem with natural infection. Although it has a tremendous number of advantages over vaccination, the one drawback is a person's inability to control, or even know, what dose of infection they are getting.
 

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Agreed. Kind of highlights the only real problem with natural infection. Although it has a tremendous number of advantages over vaccination, the one drawback is a person's inability to control, or even know, what dose of infection they are getting.
OptsyEagle, I do like your idea (I think it was yours) that low level exposure to covid-19 in the wild can be healthy for priming our immune systems. I completely agree in theory. However I still worry about controlling that dosage of the virus you get.

It seems very hard to calibrate that. However based on your idea, I have made one change. I used to wear KN95 masks quite a bit in crowded stores, but have switched to the lesser surgical masks. These still have good coverage but are not respirators like KN95, so I'm probably still inhaling some particles.

But I think when "calibrating" this, it's prudent to still be on the cautious side. I would never go and deliberately try to get exposed to COVID. The potential harm is just too great... so when living my routine daily life, I'm still wearing the surgical mask and being cautious. I think it's safe to assume I'm getting some droplets day to day.

In my apartment building, many people coming in & out don't wear masks (even though they are supposed to) and I just assume I am inhaling particles, every day.

However in really high risk settings like airports, airplanes, or a crowded office, I will be wearing a KN95/CAN95 respirator.

I think the other part of "calibrating" low dose exposure is that, if you ever actually feel run down or slightly sick, then step up to maximum protection. On days I am feeling a bit weak, or perhaps insufficient sleep, I put my guard up to max and don't take any chances around people.
 

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Agreed. Kind of highlights the only real problem with natural infection. Although it has a tremendous number of advantages over vaccination, the one drawback is a person's inability to control, or even know, what dose of infection they are getting.
A while back a study was started were they were going to determine the minimal effective dose by infecting people with different levels of the actual covid virus ... never heard about the results.

In the real world people have very little control over the actual dose(s) they will receive. To make matters worse, the amount of time before the body will attack it is a variable, in other words, even thought two people received a "minimal dose" person A maybe fight it off quickly while person B gets heavily infected before their body mounts a real attack.

As a side note, possibly an attenuated live virus covid vaccine would work much better than what we currently have.
 

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The idea that some exposure to the virus boosting our immune systems significantly has been studied and confirmed in many different ways. Effectively, before vaccine and even after the invention of vaccine, that is how pandemics stopped. It is how herd immunity comes about for most airborne viruses.

I have mentioned that the ability to control the dose of infection is near impossible, and there is no evidence during the covid crisis of what outcomes come from various levels of infection.

That said, since the vast majority of people survive covid-19 infection, and that was before we started vaccinating people, we must understand then that most interactions lead to a safer infection. Since we know the dose of infection will be a combination of two things:

1) Concentration of the infecting source
2) Time exposed to that source


If you simply reduce either one or preferably both of those two things, the odds of you ending up with a safe exposure is quite high...but will never be guaranteed.

So for the 1st one, I think outdoors pretty much solves that. Almost any outdoor exposure will be survivable, especially if you are vaccinated. Adjusting ones mask type for indoors, or removing it some circumstances, is also a good attempt to vary the concentration received to provide safer exposure. The other great method to reduce concentration is to introduce room ventilation. Either open a window, start a fan or run your furnace blower (can be done without cooling or heating on most furnaces).

For the 2nd one, just attempt to reduce the times you are indoors with others to shorter intervals. Since dying from covid is less common the people that did it must have had a rare high amount of time with the infecting source. So assuming the average social gathering lasts 1 hour (that amount cannot possibly be the most time), just embrace any indoor opportunity that will see you indoors with someone for less then 1 hour. The shorter the better. You probably don't need a lot of Delta for a boost. Now always keep in mind, #1 while doing this. Are you going indoors with someone when they have been in there themselves breathing for the entire day or their teenage kid was in there playing video games for 5 hrs. Are their 10 kids in the man cave of this house you just walked into (never assume only one is infected). How big is this room? Is there any ventilation happening in this room. If so, a longer stay is probably pretty safe for a fully vaccinated healthy person.

Anyway, I agree, teaching people to do this, will be near impossible but I am not finding it too overwhelming by any means. I would imagine many others could understand it as well.
 

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As I said teaching people the above will be near impossible so we need to deal with our biggest pandemic problem first. We need to get the people age 50 or older who have not received a vaccination shot to vaccinate. If we can persuade the vast majority of these people to vaccinate, we can safely start exposing ourselves to this virus and finally end this pandemic once and for all.

Technically Alberta and Saskatchewan attempted my safe virus exposure experiment, although without actually calling it that, or teaching anyone how to do it safely or even that they were doing it at all, but lets face it, their experiment failed miserably. That is because they had too many people age 50 or older unvaccinated. If they, and us, deal with that problem, safe exposure will have significantly less fall out, then if this vulnerable group stay unvaccinated.

Sure some younger unvaccinated people in their 30s and 40s will still get very, very sick and have an absolutely horrible and scary experience with their infection, but for the most part they will get to experience that horror in their homes. Of course there will also be exceptions and breakthrough infections that send some people to the hospital but if we get the older adults vaccinated, I think the numbers here will be reduced down to a bad flu epidemic. Our hospitals deal with those every year.

Anyway, that is where I am leaning on this now. In Ontario we currently have 501,000 adults age 50 or older unvaccinated. That is pretty good considering we had over 700,000 a month ago. Vaccine passports have done the work here, I would think. We won't get them all to come forward, but I think when the Delta variant shows what it will do to them when they go indoors with others this fall, more will come forward. Their friends and family will start exerting real pressure because they will see that it is this very small group of people who are holding the entire country, and that group, back from living their lives. I am sorry, but they have to vaccinate.
 
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