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Pfizer and Moderna (company ticker symbol MRNA) are both MRNA vaccines. This MRNA is the newest technology and in some people, might show some serious allergic reactions. - this is why I'd prefer traditional vaccine like Sputnik with 92% protection or JNJ's one with 72% ... I know you guys have prejudice against Russia, but all of us got dozens of Russian vaccines and we are still alive :)
I have no problem with the Russian vaccine. I think the Chinese Sinovac sounds pretty good too.

Sinovac is a very traditional vaccine made with dead or inactive virus.

What I'm hearing from medical friends though (including a few doctors who've gotten the shot) is that they think the Pfizer vaccine is best. The cold storage requirement has been relaxed as well, so the Pfizer shots are becoming more feasible. Canada is going to get massive shipments of them soon.
 

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They already got 400K this week .... but I'm conservative , so i'd prefer traditional Russian or JNJ vaccine :)
 

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Pfizer and Moderna (company ticker symbol MRNA) are both MRNA vaccines. This MRNA is the newest technology and in some people, might show some serious allergic reactions. - this is why I'd prefer traditional vaccine like Sputnik with 92% protection or JNJ's one with 72% ... I know you guys have prejudice against Russia, but all of us got dozens of Russian vaccines and we are still alive :)
... and Russians are not?

A top Russian diplomat was caught secretly getting the Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine, shunning his country's prized Sputnik V

Do we need to say more? Duh.
 

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I thought it was the opposite. I‘ve read about the proposed mass vaccination locations. Canada’s Wonderland in Ontario being one. They’re planning for a large part of the parking lot just to be used as a post -injection waiting site. Sit in your car for 15 mins after your shot to see if you react badly. It’s just one more factor in the logistical challenge.
I don't know what the actual results have been, with respect to side effects from 1st shot versus 2nd shot, but I do know the theory. The theory is that the 2nd shot should result in more side effects. The theory goes that the more severe effects, fever, headaches, fatigue are a result of your own immune system responding to what it sees as a viral invader. Since your body's immune systems has already been tuned up well from the 1st shot it is theorized that your immune response from the 2nd shot should be more severe. More intense.

In any case, J4B is correct. You want to avoid a big schedule of things to do on the days you get the shot. Many, and some might say, most people don't experience much with respect to the vaccine shots. Not sure why that is. I would feel a little better if my temperature increased a couple degrees, because I would know that my immune system is working properly. The others, that don't get side effects, might be working properly as well, but how do they know?

Anyway, I would not schedule a big day for other activities, on the day of your shots and be careful about assuming your 2nd shot will go the same way as your 1st.
 

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"A top Russian diplomat" ?! Really?! It was Yuri Gribkov, who is Russia's consul general to Estonia... Possibly for him it was easier to get Pfizer as he lives in Estonia.

On the other hand, The really top Canadian politician Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Danny Williams choses US for Heath Care
Do we need to say more? Duh.
 

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"A top Russian diplomat" ?! Really?! It was Yuri Gribkov, who is Russia's consul general to Estonia... Possibly for him it was easier to get Pfizer as he lives in Estonia.
... that is what you're assuming. He can easily return to Moscow to get the Sputnik or have the Sputnik delivered to him ...

On the other hand, The really top Canadian politician Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Danny Williams choses US for Heath Care
Do we need to say more? Duh.
... big difference between choosing a vaccine and a healthcare systems.

Besides, this comparison is irrevelant to your claim that CMFrs are prejudiced against Russia which is a a BIG FALSE claim or LIE (giving you the benefit of the doubt.)
 

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I do not know if we will have a choice. I suspect that we will get whatever they are administering at that particular time.
 

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I do not know if we will have a choice. I suspect that we will get whatever they are administering at that particular time.
and even if they have quite a few types of vaccine available, I imagine someone else other then the person receiving the shot, will make that most important decision.

We are wayyyyy too biased and selfish to make the correct one. It is best that it is made by others looking at the larger picture.
 

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They already got 400K this week .... but I'm conservative , so i'd prefer traditional Russian or JNJ vaccine :)
Both of those are viral vector vaccines (AstraZeneca as well), not traditional inactivated virus vaccines. If I had a choice, I'd go for mRNA vaccines over any of the viral vectors.
 

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^ Well, I'll be hearing about the 2nd dose's effects ... hopefully none.
... an update to my post ... no side-effects on the 2nd dose of Pfizer's vaccine in both groups, though getting it took alot longer due to a delay caused by the freakish snow-storm, blackouts, etc. ... yep over there in Texas, the [email protected]' state.
 

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... an update to my post ... no side-effects on the 2nd dose of Pfizer's vaccine in both groups, though getting it took alot longer due to a delay caused by the freakish snow-storm, blackouts, etc. ... yep over there in Texas, the [email protected]' state.
Please source your claim of "no side effects".
Quite simply, I've never heard of any medical intervention without a risk of side effects
 

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^ If you read my post sloowwllyyy, it is an "update" to the "2nd" dose of the Pfizer vaccine that my relatives got more than a week ago (of which I didn't hear about until yesterday via a phone-call). And the feedback was "all is okay this time as no rash (for the senior folks in their 70s), no headache(for the younger folks in their 30s) unlike the very 1st dose they got about a month ago where those were the side-effects which strangely didn't come about until the 11th day after injection.

So I'm not exactly sure what "source" you need me to provide on "my claim of no-side effects (on this 2nd shot)" short of divulging their personal details here. I heard it first hand so it's up to you to believe it or not.

Please Note: I'm not making a broad statement or a disclaimer here of "no side-effects" on (any) vaccines. Everyone will respond differently.

And the state of Texas remains as the Lone Star state, filled with [email protected], including some of my relatives.
 

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^ If you read my post sloowwllyyy, it is an "update" to the "2nd" dose of the Pfizer vaccine that my relatives got more than a week ago (of which I didn't hear about until yesterday via a phone-call). And the feedback was "all is okay this time as no rash (for the senior folks in their 70s), no headache(for the younger folks in their 30s) unlike the very 1st dose they got about a month ago where those were the side-effects which strangely didn't come about until the 11th day after injection.

So I'm not exactly sure what "source" you need me to provide on "my claim of no-side effects (on this 2nd shot)" short of divulging their personal details here. I heard it first hand so it's up to you to believe it or not.

Please Note: I'm not making a broad statement or a disclaimer here of "no side-effects" on (any) vaccines. Everyone will respond differently.

And the state of Texas remains as the Lone Star state, filled with [email protected], including some of my relatives.
I didn't realize that you were commenting on a specific personal/small group of no side effect.
 

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I attended a vaccine info session with my work (they are linked in with Provincial health) so we had one of the medical professional join us ( the person we work with in developing COVID health measures and recommendations).

In my province, they are allowing people 50-64 with no health concerns to allow earlier vaccination with the AstraZeneca. The reasoning is that though safe, the vaccine was tested for under 65. Though it has a lower effectiveness for transmission, (~65%), the effectiveness for reducing severe outcomes and death was similar to the other vaccines.

It was asked if people get AstraZeneca now, and then a different 'booster' later. The answer was not at this time, they are going to focus on getting everyone their first shot, then their second before they even consider another round for a different vaccine. They said there was lots of other considerations they have look into such as supply, logistics, and safety. So it wasn't a no, but it was just a maybe.

In terms of spreading out the vaccines to longer than the initial recommendations, was it was okay, in fact it could be better. The timing of the second shot is based on the drug companies, and is a MINIMUM time to wait. For vaccines that require multiple shots, doing it too early will reduce the effectiveness, however doing it later can increase the effectiveness. They tried to explain it in simple terms. Essentially, when you get your first shot, your body starts to build an immunity to it. The next shot is the earliest it will have built immunity. So if you get the next shot too early, your body hasn't had the chance maximize its immunity, so then second shot you are start at a lower immunity level. If you wait, your body will be at the best immunity level at the beginning of the second dose. There is a sweet spot that you don't want to be too long, but it has to be a really long time. So essentially the Feds would have to really screw up for the second dose not to be effective. I found this part most interesting. Sorry, if don't have the medical information or any links.

They are expecting to give all adults who want it by June for this first dose. They are still waiting for vaccines for kids, but it is on the horizon, just not time frame.
 

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I think the booster later is really a matter of "we will watch how things go and decide then". Almost all of the observations, they should get, will be a small percentage of the people getting a little sicker then they would prefer to see, but most importantly, they should not be dying...which in those same cases observed, may very well have been the case.

Sounds fine to me. Where do I sign up.
 

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Myself, I would take any of the vaccines approved in Canada. I'm not at all concerned about JNJ and AZ being inadequate.

I even heard an interview with a board member of Pfizer saying that the JNJ vaccine looked amazing and tremendously effective. That's a competitor saying that!

I'm only concerned about ending up in hospital or dying (my 35 year old family member ended up in hospital for example). If I still get the sniffles or have a bad week, whatever, just not a big deal. All of the vaccines used in Canada are highly effective at reducing hospitalization and death.

I'm also completely on board with first shots ASAP, and delaying second shot, strategy. Here's the argument from a BC infectious disease expert that I posted earlier.
 

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I have been looking a little closer at these vaccines and their trial data. We might recall that the AZ vaccine has a efficacy of 62.1%. You might also recall that they had an interesting observation for a group of participants where they accidently gave them a 1/2 dose for their first dose and then gave them a full dose for their 2nd. That AZ group had an efficacy of 90%. They figured it all out by June and the 62.1% were the new people who got the proper doses. The only reason they know about the 90% group was they kept an eye on them.

I also took a look at a chart that Dr. Bonnie Henry of BC listed to show the efficacy of a single dose of Pfizer vaccine. Originally Pfizer said that their vaccine only had a 52% efficacy with a single dose, but Dr. Henry's team noticed that Pfizer looked at their results after 7 days of the 1st dose. If you looked at the results after 14 days of the 1st dose, you obtained a 92.6% efficacy. That is why they determined they could put out the 2nd dose by 4 months because they felt these people were well protected. A bit of a leap there but I won't drone on about that at this time.

Here is my point. Both Dr. Henry's study of an entire 1 week (day 14 to day 21) where they obtained a 92.6% efficacy and Astra Zeneca's miracle numbers where they obtained a 90% efficacy (on the wrong dosing group) were ALL conducted before June 2020.

If you look at Pfizer's study below and just focus on the Placebo group, you will see that in their entire study that encompassed around 29 weeks, they had 172 infections in the placebo group. In just the 3 weeks between the 1st dose and the 2nd dose they saw 82 infections in that same placebo group. So in 3 / 29 = 10.3% of the time, they observed 82 / 172 = 47.7% of ALL observed infections in the placebo group. Does that seem weird to anyone? These 47.7% infections in 3 weeks were in and around April 2020, if I recall the timeline.

What I think is happening is those 3 weeks is that we were NOT really using full precautions worldwide, nearly as much as we are today. Covid had more of a free reign. It is about the only explanation as to why so many infections happened so quickly. What it also means then, is that when we drop our precautions, the vaccines that were measured after June (Astra Zeneca for example) may very well have efficacies GREATER then what they measured during a study that cannot help but be affected by our intervening precautions. Probably the reason AZ got the 90% efficacy, was not because of the screwed up low 1st dose, during the trial that began in April and was noticed by June, but because there were more dangerous infections (larger initial dose of infections) going around making it easier for the vaccines to show how effective they really are.

It is very likely that when we drop our precautions we will find that the 90% efficacy is the more accurate number that relates to the AstraZeneca Vaccine. Since JNJ got a late start as well their vaccine trial would have been affected in the same way. Anyway, I thought it was interesting enough to post. It certainly does not prove anything specific but is interesting all the same.

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I'm only concerned about ending up in hospital or dying (my 35 year old family member ended up in hospital for example). If I still get the sniffles or have a bad week, whatever, just not a big deal. All of the vaccines used in Canada are highly effective at reducing hospitalization and death.
Even some people who had mild illness (i.e. didn't go to hospital) are dealing with long-term issues. We really don't know/understand much about long-haulers, but for me, I'm concerned about getting COVID at all. I realize that govt/public health has a goal to reduce hospitalizations and death, but that's not my personal goal.
 

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Even some people who had mild illness (i.e. didn't go to hospital) are dealing with long-term issues. We really don't know/understand much about long-haulers, but for me, I'm concerned about getting COVID at all. I realize that govt/public health has a goal to reduce hospitalizations and death, but that's not my personal goal.
OK that is a good point
 

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Even some people who had mild illness (i.e. didn't go to hospital) are dealing with long-term issues. We really don't know/understand much about long-haulers, but for me, I'm concerned about getting COVID at all. I realize that govt/public health has a goal to reduce hospitalizations and death, but that's not my personal goal.
None of the vaccines can keep you from getting Covid-19. All they do is help you quickly neutralize it quicker then you could without it.
 
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